5 ton clutch problems - Steel Soldiers::Military Vehicles Supersite

2deuce · 09-01-2006, 21:30

I'm looking for some advice on what may be wrong with the clutch. It has the Gasser engine and hasn't been run in a few years. Got it started, pushed in the clutch pedal, went in gear fine, moved it forward about 15 feet, thought I would test the brakes but it wouldn't come out of gear. I adjusted all the free play out of the pedal but no change. Won't go in gear with the engine running. Any ideas what might have happened in my short test drive?

Thanks,
Greg

devilman96 · 09-01-2006, 22:10

Proably broke a finger or two on the pressure plate. Happens when they sit for to long, the plates rust and to much force causes the fingers to let go at the base. My deuce was a victim of this but it took a little longer for it to go. Did so about 260 miles into the trip home, lucky I had Kenny to the rescue with his tow bar.

I assume because I don't know 5 tons but there is proably a small inspection cover, pull it and take a look inside at the plate fingers near the swivel point bet ya find at least one broke and at least another two cracked or broken.

Yank the tranny... buy or rebuild the clutch and pressure plate... surface the flywheel... change the rear main seal... Pilot bearing... gripe... piss... moan.... and be happy when its all over with...

2deuce · 09-01-2006, 23:39

I looked up in the inspection hole and can see nothing wrong except that 2 springs in the clutch seem to be very close together, but then again maybe they should be. I didn't see any broken parts. I had my son push in the pedal while I watched thru the inspection hole. I could see the throwout bearing move forward but those 2 springs never moved. That transmission looks very heavy. If I have to pull it is it possible to just move it back enough or does it have to come all the way down and out?

Thanks

Recovry4x4 · 09-02-2006, 00:38

The tranny is suspended by the bellhousing. Once slid back you would be sitting under it working and I don't trust anything hanging like that. You can use an engine hoist through the passenger door or a 4x4 across the back of the cab through the window and a QUALITY come a long to suspend and drop it on the ground. No way in creation would I get under that transmission.

devilman96 · 09-02-2006, 08:30

Kinda hard to spot unless you know what your looking for... The fingers stay in place and move as they should aganst the bearing when pushing the clutch in and out... But part of or all of the pressure plate does not move and disengage. You would need to rotate the clutch and look at each side one by one to see if the PP is moving in and out (not the fingers and bearing).

Check out the photos below, you can see where the fingers like to break, it may not be possible to see this part of the plate in the truck (I don't know).

As for the tranny... just count on dropping it, its big but is far easier than doing most cars on the road today. Like Kenny said... stay out from under the darn thing because it will flatten you like a pancake.

gringeltaube · 09-02-2006, 10:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2deuce

Won't go in gear with the engine running.

I would also suspect the input shaft sticking in the pilot bearing (grease dried out, rust, etc. after so many years standing still).
Did you try to "force" it into 4th or 5th while standing, engine running and clutch pedal depressed?
Tranny has to be pulled anyways!

2deuce · 09-02-2006, 12:16

Thanks for all those pictures. I can't see that area from the inspection plate. There is a crossmember right under the inspection plate that makes it hard to see in there also. It does look like the 2 springs that I can see are touching eachother, one almost behind the other. It doesn't look right, but it may be the skewed angle that I have to look up in there.
I didn't try to force it in gear with the engine running,but I did give it a yank out of 1st gear when I pushed in the clutch pedal and the clutch didn't work. I did put the transfer case in neutral and run it through the gears but not before I had problems with it.
My biggest concern is getting the transmission down and then back up and lining that huge thing up. It makes a deuce transmission look tiny. It will have to go back 6 inches or so to clear that crossmember. If I suspend it from the top with a 4x4, I think moving it back to lower it might be impossible. If it would go nearly straight down that could work but it can't. It is on a cement floor so if I had something to jack it up and roll it back then lower it, that might work.The engine hoist might work if I can get it to roll back. I'll do some measuring. Please post if you have done this job or have a good idea how best to get the job done. I know I don't want to be underneath that heavy thing, I like pancakes but I don't want to be one!
Here I am, pissin and moaning and I haven't even started yet.
Greg

gringeltaube · 09-02-2006, 14:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2deuce

My biggest concern is getting the transmission down and then back up and lining that huge thing up. It makes a deuce transmission look tiny. It will have to go back 6 inches or so to clear that crossmember. If I suspend it from the top with a 4x4, I think moving it back to lower it might be impossible.

I know it's not a lightweight but nothing is to heavy for a good chain hoist... Use two at the same time, one for one aft, hanging from the same pole at 2' distance at an angle, attached to the same shackle/chain around the tranny. That way you can control the horizontal movement without risk.

Don't know about that crossmember...

Recovry4x4 · 09-02-2006, 15:32

I know about the swing of it, dealt with that before. When removing I put the lifting device a little towards the back so when it comes loose it swings back. Do the reverse for the install. When it gets close I pull the tranny back and have soldier B crank the lifting device. Pain? Yes! Can it be done in the parking lot of Walmart? Yes! Be careful and wear the common sense hat. Engine crane through the passenger door is much easier. The 6352 and 6453 are pretty hefty gear boxes and arre one of the biggest shnchromesh boxes I know of.

M543A2 · 09-07-2006, 06:57

There is a nice transmission removal hoist made by the military for this job. I happened to pick one up on Govliquidation a few years ago. It has legs that sit on the cab floor each side of the opening with a winch and cable you attach to the trans. The winch drum is supported by bearings on a square shaft such that once the trans is supported and loosened from the bell, it can be slid back far enough to remove the pilot shaft out of the bell and clutch. To re install, you slide it forward. I see you are too far from Indiana for me to let you borrow it. If someone closer has one, it would be the nicest thing you ever used for the job!
Regards Marti Sacks