Requirements in Michigan to drive a 5 ton. - Steel Soldiers::Military Vehicles Supersite

ida34 · 12-19-2006, 21:39

Derby asked me to look up something related to F endorsements to non-commercial driver's licenses. There are two endorsements that apply to private and farm related driving. If you are driving for a farm operation and meet the other requirements you will need an F endorsement for any vehicle combination over 26001 lbs. The five ton is over this so for farm use you need an F endorsement. The only other non-commercial driver's license endorsement is an R which is for any private fifth wheel combination where a second trailer is attached to the back of the first trailer (recreational double). This one was a new one to me and this is why I ask other more experienced people or look it up myself. Again I researched the deuce specifically before this. Air brakes make no difference. If you are driving around a large tractor and fifth wheel trailer with 40,000 lbs of scrap metal then you would have a hard time convincing most officers that you put together 40,000 lbs of metal through personal use. (This is not an attack on the other poster that did this. I will not name names but I think he has a CDL anyway.)

There is an exemption to the exemption for the F endorsement that involves hazardous material. I did not read through this but can locate it if anyone wants to read it. Below are the links.

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(muvjhe3zygdgar55rvvavz3i))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-257-312e

(9) Except as otherwise provided in subsections (10) and (11), this section does not apply to a driver or operator of a vehicle under all of the following conditions:

(a) The vehicle is controlled and operated by a farmer or an employee or family member of the farmer.

(b) The vehicle is used to transport agricultural products, farm machinery, farm supplies, or a combination of these items, to or from a farm.

(c) The vehicle is not used in the operation of a common or contract motor carrier.

(d) The vehicle is operated within 150 miles of the farm.

(10) A person, before driving or operating a combination of vehicles having a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more on the power unit that is used as described in subsection (9)(a) to (d), shall obtain an F vehicle endorsement. The F vehicle endorsement shall be issued upon successful completion of a knowledge test only.

(11) A person, before driving or operating a single vehicle truck having a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more or a combination of vehicles having a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more on the power unit that is used as described in subsection (9)(a) to (d) for carrying hazardous materials on which a placard is required under 49 CFR parts 100 to 199, shall successfully complete both a knowledge test and a driving skills test. Upon successful completion of the knowledge test and driving skills test, the person shall be issued the appropriate vehicle group designation and any vehicle endorsement necessary under this act.

(12) This section does not apply to a police officer operating an authorized emergency vehicle or to a firefighter operating an authorized emergency vehicle who has met the driver training standards published under the fire fighters training council act of 1966, 1966 PA 291, MCL 29.361 to 29.377.

(13) This section does not apply to a person operating a vehicle used exclusively to transport personal possessions or family members for nonbusiness purposes.

Here is a link to a simple English pamphlet by the Secretary of State.

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/co...nse_8574_7.pdf

Bottom line. For non commercial or farm use you do not need any special endorsements for a 5 ton unless it is a fifth wheel tractor with a second trailer attached behind the first one and then you need an R endorsement.

ida34 · 12-19-2006, 21:49

I am sorry but I can't get the links to work so please cut and paste.

rizzo · 12-19-2006, 22:28

under exemptions:
This section does not apply to a person operating a motor home or a vehicle used exclusively to transport personal possessions or
family members for nonbusiness purposes. MCL 257.312e(

above the indorsements it says: INDORSEMENTS ARE ONLY REQUIRED IF A CDL IS REQUIRED

I don't think you need anything., but make sure you have a non commercial plate. One of the SOS offices would only give my friend a commercial plate. even though he used it for non commercial purposes. Not everyone knows their job like they should.

Recovry4x4 · 12-19-2006, 23:43

Glad I have a fitzall license.

westfolk · 12-19-2006, 23:55

Chuck, not to name names, lol. Yeah I do have a CDL and I, luckily, have all the endorsements to move anything except people(never had a bus to take the road test). Since the CDL came into effect, what 1991, or 2 all the states pretty much have agreeing laws. That is NOT to say they all do agree. Heck under Federal law you must be 21 to obtain a CDL. However in PA at age 19 you can get a CDL that is only good for intrastate driving, which automatically turns to interstate at 21. Go figure. In PA the # is 26,001lbs. If you are under that and no air brakes a regular license is all you need. With the exception that a towed vehicle(trailer) not exceed 10,000lbs. As a rule anyone that asks I tell them you do not need anything more than the standard issue license, unless you exceed the weight restrictions. Then it's your buck.

ida34 · 12-20-2006, 11:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by rizzo

under exemptions:
This section does not apply to a person operating a motor home or a vehicle used exclusively to transport personal possessions or
family members for nonbusiness purposes. MCL 257.312e(

above the indorsements it says: INDORSEMENTS ARE ONLY REQUIRED IF A CDL IS REQUIRED

I don't think you need anything., but make sure you have a non commercial plate. One of the SOS offices would only give my friend a commercial plate. even though he used it for non commercial purposes. Not everyone knows their job like they should.

Rizzo,
The commercial plate is kind of a weird thing. You can get a commercial plate for a four door sedan and it used to be that all pickups had them even the non-commercial trucks. When you transfered a plate from car to a truck they would take the plate and give you another. This has changed and regular format pass car plates are now issued to privately owned pickups. The weight is what triggered the commercial plate with your friend. The plate is issued by the weight category of the truck but this does not mean he has a commercial truck unless he uses it for commercial purposes. The computer sees a certain gvw and pumps out a registration and plate to match. It really does not have anything to do with commercial use. The SOS lady vapor locked on my 13,000 lbs historical vehicle but another worker at the Chelsea branch straightened her out. In this respect the weight dependent registrations and plates an not really commercial plates but weight dependent. When you get to smaller vehicles the plates become commercial DF-7988 or private vehicle ASD-9988 or ADF-998. Your buddy should not have to stop at weigh stations and such. If he was operating commercially he would need a company name and location on both sides of the truck. He may get stopped from time to time and have to explain he is not commercial but I doubt it. If you want I will dig into this and find out for sure. I have not read it in a long time but this is how I understand it.

Also, I talked to Pat. He was a little fuzzy on who I was talking about since I don't know your real name so at the next get together mention something to him about me.

Chuck

ida34 · 12-20-2006, 11:35

Westfolk,
You just gave me a handy situation to use.

Chuck

ida34 · 12-20-2006, 11:47

Note to all. My truck has a historical plate that is zip tied on the bumper. This is not legal. It needs to be permanently attached to the rear of the vehicle with a light. I have the light but have not had time to attach it to the truck with the plate. I more worry about being pulled over for driving stuff to the dump with it but I only make this sort of trips infrequently and the historical vehicle law is so vague that I feel I can get away with it. I do not use the truck regularly to get stuff or take stuff to the dump so I should be OK. The law basically says parades blah blah blah and ETC. The it adds that the vehicle can not be used for everyday transportation. I don't use it for everyday transportation but I could see where the line is gray and some may disagree with me. At any rate I know I could effectively defend my position at any traffic court because of the vague language of the law.

chevy43 · 12-20-2006, 22:02

I know that road testing is leagal and why should you "test" you vehicle and not be getting something done at the same time?

rizzo · 12-20-2006, 22:10

I talked to pat, his brother want him to go to my mudbog next year. I told him he could do recovery with the deuce.