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Another way to lower an M1101/M1102

rustystud

rustystud

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74M35A2 said:
We just had a presentation on this from Timken. They mentioned there should be approx 0.003" of movement in the hub when pushed in/out at final adjustment. They said as the bearing heats, this play becomes almost zero. If one starts with zero play, this then becomes tighter and can tear up the bearing.
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I have set through that presentation before too. The US manufacturers like to have loose bearings and the Europeans like tight bearings. Go figure. That's why I keep stressing use the manual.
 
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gimpyrobb

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You should quit stressing, most folks here don't listen when we say good info is in the manual(rtfm)! Your gonna loose all your hair.













Oh, wait, looks like its already gone...
 
rustystud

rustystud

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gimpyrobb said:
You should quit stressing, most folks here don't listen when we say good info is in the manual(rtfm)! Your gonna loose all your hair.


Your right Chris. I guess I'm just being the eternal optimist hoping someone will actually read the TM's (Manuals) just once.
I still have a few hairs to save, so I better start being a pessimist !
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1stDeuce

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?? Uh, you guys are killing me. I went to the manual first, and it's CRAP. Normally I'm the first to suggest a person RTFM, but in this case, we need to find the guy who wrote TFM and smack him upside the head. :hammer:

(I know we're not suppose to use texting shorthand on SS, but I think RTFM can pass as "common language" here on SS. )

At this point, I'm kinda sorry I mentioned it, but a 140lb tire and wheel coming off on the highway when the bearings seize is a VERY serious problem! Once in civilian hands, the usage of these trailers is quite different (Faster!) than when in military service, and the bearing need to be adjusted PROPERLY, which is NOT covered by the TM.

Now back to my regularly scheduled slacking.:whistle:
 
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Tow4

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74M35A2 said:
We just had a presentation on this from Timken. They mentioned there should be approx 0.003" of movement in the hub when pushed in/out at final adjustment. They said as the bearing heats, this play becomes almost zero. If one starts with zero play, this then becomes tighter and can tear up the bearing.
Click to expand...
I doubt you can tell 0.003" of movement in the hub. Do they expect you to use a dial indicator?
 
rustystud

rustystud

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Tow4 said:
I doubt you can tell 0.003" of movement in the hub. Do they expect you to use a dial indicator?
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Actually you can tell the difference with a long pinch bar. Our New Flyer and Gillig busses both have the front wheel bearings set with .002" to .003" endplay. After awhile you can feel the difference.
For the first few hundred times you still use the dial indicator.
 
rustystud

rustystud

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1stDeuce said:
?? Uh, you guys are killing me. I went to the manual first, and it's CRAP. Normally I'm the first to suggest a person RTFM, but in this case, we need to find the guy who wrote TFM and smack him upside the head. :hammer:

(I know we're not suppose to use texting shorthand on SS, but I think RTFM can pass as "common language" here on SS. )

At this point, I'm kinda sorry I mentioned it, but a 140lb tire and wheel coming off on the highway when the bearings seize is a VERY serious problem! Once in civilian hands, the usage of these trailers is quite different (Faster!) than when in military service, and the bearing need to be adjusted PROPERLY, which is NOT covered by the TM.

Now back to my regularly scheduled slacking.:whistle:
Click to expand...
Funny you mentioned the wheel coming off. Several years ago we had a mechanic install the front wheels on a 60ft New Flyer bus. He didn't tighten the lock nut properly. The bus had just got on the freeway when the whole wheel assembly came off ( all 300 Ibs ) and went past the bus ! The driver immediately stopped the bus and called the coordinator (then cleaned out his pants). Thankfully the tire hit the underpass pilings and not another vehicle ! Needless to say the mechanic lost his job. Since it was a 60ft bus with a center axle, the front axle stayed up with only the one wheel.
As far as a wheel coming off from seized bearings, I have never heard of that happening. Usually the wheel seizes to the spindle and acts like a giant brake stopping the vehicle. I have been in a vehicle that did seize the right front wheel. My buddies car on the freeway ! It pulled us to the side of the road really fast ! 60 MPH to 0 in seconds !
 
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1stDeuce

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I just edited the first post to add some pictures of the finished product underneath, and a side shot showing the wheel opening. (I moved the axle forward 1/2" on the second trialer, and I'm doing that on all of them from now on! :)
 
C

contdevelop

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Hello- This is a good write up. I too am considering lowering my 2010 M1102. When I bought it, the first thing I did was sell the 37 inch tires, and I ordered the 6 lug hubs from etrailer.com and was basically given a set of 6 lug wheels from a friend who swapped out the wheels on his Hummer H3. I read the aluminum box weighs between 300-400 pounds, and the whole trailer is about 1400 pounds.

I would like to reduce the overall weight and make it a lot lighter. I assume the weight is in the frame?? Right now I am considering cutting the plates off the frame and getting rid of the heavy torsion axle in favor of leaf springs and a solid axle..... Overall goal is to lower it A LOT and reduce the weight. I tow it now with full size chevy truck but would like to tow it with my 4.0 Jeep Wrangler.

Thoughts on how to reduce the weight, and thoughts on converting to leaf springs/ solid axle? Of course I would like to put a 2 inch ball mount and get rid of the 12 inch riser plate and pintle hitch....

Thanks. By the way, new to this forum.

My other option was to remove the aluminum box and mount it on my other all aluminum tilt trailer, since that trailer has a wood deck and wood sides that need replacing... I really only only bought the M1102 for the aluminum box...
 
1stDeuce

1stDeuce

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contdevelop said:
You''re a real funny guy.
Click to expand...
I think he meant to be, but for what you are asking, he has a point... You may have the wrong trailer.

I've pulled mine with my 4.0L Wrangler, and they're just too dang big! (Too wide at least!) Really this trailer is even wider than my full size truck, so it's just too much for my Jeep to pull down the road. (Wind drag is HORRIBLE behind the Jeep!) While it would be cool to narrow it by about 2', that would be a LOT of work, and the trailers aren't assembled in a way that makes them easy to disassemble.

The box is pretty much part of the frame, and the frame is pretty much part of the box, and the entire thing is rivited/huck bolted aluminum, except for the straight part of the tongue that extends under the trailer, the coupler, and the axle.

You've done the easiest part: each of the 37" runflats weighs 160lbs!! The 285's on aluminum wheels that I mounted weighed 75lbs each, so I dropped 170lbs there. Sounds like you dropped a little more with the 6-lug hubs, and likely lighter tires.

If you don't mind having a trailer w/o brakes, or don't mind converting to electric, getting the hydraulic surge assembly off the tongue and putting a light weight ball coupler on it would probably knock off another 75lbs or so. That would get you down to 1075lbs. If you put a lighter axle under it, and knocked off another 100lbs, you're down to 975lbs. With the way the trailer is built, mounting a leaf spring axle wouldn't be too simple though, and the trailer is still dang wide for a Jeep...

It's built heavy for a reason, and making it significantly lighter just isn't very easy.
The box also has the axle too far back to look good as a pickup bed, and probably too far back for proper tongue weight on a Jeep too... They're pretty tongue heavy when loaded, which my Jeep doesn't appreciate.

But have fun making it yours! For the money they are a great deal even if they're not ideal. :)
 
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1stDeuce

1stDeuce

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Ford Mechanic said:
How hard was it putting the bead lock in the smaller tire?
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Huh?? I got rid of the bead locks, and so did contdevelop. ?? I highly recommend it if you're just dragging the thing around as a utility trailer. I sold a set of four for $800, and two for $300, so I just about paid for all three trailers by selling the 37's!! :)

I'm now running GM "PYO" aluminum wheels painted semi-gloss black, and they work out very nicely!
 
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tim292stro

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1stDeuce said:
Hmm. Here it is, right from the TM:

While turning the hub/drum slowly, tighten the spindle nut (3) to seat bearings.

Back off the spindle nut as required to align the cotter pin hole.

Install a cotter pin (2) and bend ends to secure the spindle nut (3).

I guess it's completely open to interpretation. It just says tighten... My brother would put about 100ftlbs on it, then back it off till the cotter just fit. Which is WRONG, but exactly what was done to my trailer.

I think it should have said "Hand Tighten to no more than 20 ftlb to seat the bearings" or something like that... Even the TM can use a little improvement it seems. As I said, good thing they're 7k hubs...
Click to expand...

The TM should have a suggestion/correction page at the back - fill it out and send it in!! No one says you have to be current/active military to improve their process, could be saving the tax payers 100's of thousands of dollars annually in blown axle repairs and replacements.

Case in point, I recall a few CUCV's coming out of active service with the Doghead solenoid mod - best practices are just that, doesn't matter what you wear.
 
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contdevelop

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Thank you for the well written response!!!! I love the M1102 and pull it fine with the Chevy. I bought my 2010 model at Fort Hood last spring in MINT condition for $400. Sold both tires for $400...so only expense is gas for the 5 hour drive and 6 lug hubs. I've blown lots more on my Jeep and other toys..... It really is a stout trailer buy way over built.

Like I said, I have a smaller, light tilt aluminum trailer....and one of my thoughts was to remove the M1102 box and mount on that.

Whats the weight rating on the M1102 axle?? I cant find that anywhere. Realistically how much weight can you haul in a 8x7 trailer, considering cubic feet?? Cant fit a car. It is a small trailer. Im basically using it for utility and hauling my ATV....thought about a camper....not sure.



1stDeuce said:
I think he meant to be, but for what you are asking, he has a point... You may have the wrong trailer.



The box is pretty much part of the frame, and the frame is pretty much part of the box, and the entire thing is rivited/huck bolted aluminum, except for the straight part of the tongue that extends under the trailer, the coupler, and the axle.

But have fun making it yours! For the money they are a great deal even if they're not ideal. :)
Click to expand...
 
1stDeuce

1stDeuce

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There should be a tag on the axle, right in the middle. It says 4300lbs on every trailer I have. If that really is the limit, then it's based on the durometer of rubber in the suspension... Every other part on the axle is the same as axles rated up to 7000lbs... I think realistically, it would haul just about whatever fits in the bed, so long as you didn't have too much tongue weight on the tow vehicle. Guess I'll know soon enough... Time to fill the 200 gallon water tank I have mounted on one of my trailers. The other is getting a 275 gallon tank. I don't expect there will be any issues. :)
 
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