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Louisiana - State Asking for NHTSA sticker for deuce titled and registered in 2009

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frodobaggins

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Good day SS,

I received the following letter. I sent them a response, but I felt I should post this here and get some feedback as well as make everyone aware of the issue.

Frodo

MVProb.jpg
 

NDT

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Omg, they must think it is a HMMWV. See the closed Ripsaw thread on this. What a disaster. This could spread like wildfire throughout the 50.
 

98G

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"Proving contractually-required compliance with FMVSS-equivalent requirements has already been done. The MIL-STD-1180-B document has already been accepted by a Wis. court as demonstrating that FMVSS and the MIL-STD requirements are the same. Other courts would typically consider this prior ruling."

Quoted from Undysworld in relation to Idaho's recent pushback.

Thanks for posting this, and please keep us informed.
 

undysworld

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The MIL-STD-1180-B describes the vehicles included as tired (not tracked) up to and including 5-ton variants, so it applies to a deuce. It gives the equivalent FMVSS for each MIL-STD.
http://everyspec.com/MIL-STD/MIL-STD-1100-1299/MIL-STD-1180B_22183/

The court case acknowledged the correlation between the MIL-STD and FMVSS as "demonstrating" FMVSS compliance.
Initial appeal: http://165.189.64.94/Documents/DHA/Decisions/DOT/2011/110016.pdf
Re-hearing and overturn of appeal: http://165.189.64.94/Documents/DHA/Decisions/DOT/2012/110016.pdf

You might show them those.

Also point out that they willingly register thousands of other vehicles that never met FMVSS, namely: everything pre-1968. At most, these vehicles pass an inspection for compliance with state equipment requirements. If your truck meets the state equipment requirements (or could be modified to do so), they may reconsider.

If they are stuck on FMVSS compliance, here are a few talking points:

One issue with proving FMVSS-compliance of an individual vehicle is that testing for it is near-impossible. Parts of the testing are destructive: at what psi does the brake hose fail? By the time you've tested the vehicle, it's damaged. This works for a manufacturer who can afford to sacrifice a couple test cars, but not so well for individual owners.

Finding proof of compliance with FMVSS also has problems. The manufacturers who built the stuff don't keep documents around for long; far less than 10 years. So finding documentation is like unobtanium. Discovery of the MIL-STD document was exceptional luck. (Thanks Mark P.)

Since 1969, US vehicles are required to have Certification Labels showing FMVSS-compliance, but this is not foolproof either. The label certifies that the vehicle met FMVSS at the time it was manufactured, not that it meets FMVSS at the current date. A vehicle can go out-of-compliance merely by the failure of a headlight or seatbelt - the label doesn't prove compliance.

While the presence of a label suggests FMVSS-compliance, the absence of a label doesn't prove non-compliance. Whether the labels get damaged, painted over, or the whole door gets replaced, the label can be gone, but the car is still the same car. Your truck lacking a label does not prove non-compliance, but the MIL-STD does prove compliance.

Ask that your vehicle be held to the same (not higher) standards as all other vehicles of that model-year. Do they check for labels on other 1971 vehicles as a condition of registration? If not, are there any other equipment requirements that apply to a 1971 vehicle, such as within Louisiana state statute? I'd ask them to deal with your vehicle like the other pre-1969 or non-FMVSS-compliant vehicles: to require that your vehicle meet all of the Louisiana state equipment requirements that apply. If an inspection is part of that routine, then so be it.
 

gimpyrobb

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"Proving contractually-required compliance with FMVSS-equivalent requirements has already been done. The MIL-STD-1180-B document has already been accepted by a Wis. court as demonstrating that FMVSS and the MIL-STD requirements are the same. Other courts would typically consider this prior ruling."

Quoted from Undysworld in relation to Idaho's recent pushback.

Thanks for posting this, and please keep us informed.
I believe 5he legal term is president
 

juanprado

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What plate do you have? Or are you Military Vin Stencil?

The phone number on the letter is the Prestige Plates unit where Tabitha works.
 

undysworld

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Valence,

I'm like that old Skynyrd song: I know a little. But I don't know how to do what you're suggesting. I'd LOVE to have some place to make all this stuff accessible to others here. One of these days, I just ain't gonna be around... :roll:

I believe MVPA just put a lot of it online.

Any advice or help would be welcomed.

Thanks,
Paul
 

98G

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Omg, they must think it is a HMMWV. See the closed Ripsaw thread on this. What a disaster. This could spread like wildfire throughout the 50.
I don't think they have it confused with a hmmwv. I think this is a case where the left leaning nannystate wants to rid the roads of all the big scary green trucks.

Let's just hope it doesn't metastasize and spread. ..
 

mkcoen

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Omg, they must think it is a HMMWV. See the closed Ripsaw thread on this. What a disaster. This could spread like wildfire throughout the 50.
I don't think they have it confused with a hmmwv. I think this is a case where the left leaning nannystate wants to rid the roads of all the big scary green trucks.

Let's just hope it doesn't metastasize and spread. ..
This is why I comment every time someone tries getting around the intent of the TX FMV to save a couple of bucks on registration. Politicians can decide its easier making them all illegal instead of making sure everyone follows the rules.
 

hndrsonj

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Does this link mean that a military vehicle older than 25 years old that meet this criteria can be licensed? "Military wheeled (non-tracked) ground vehicles capable of operating on public highways at normal highway speeds, in most cases without escort, up to an dincluding 5-ton variants."
Yes, If you open the link then back up a page, it is specifically talking about FMVSS.
 
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