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blew fan clutch hose

juanprado

juanprado

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Parts stores will not readily know how to use those specs unless you get a counterman with gray hair and has been around long enough to read catalogs or buyers guides :) Everyone just click keyboards nowadays.....

But ask for this: Hydraulic or oil hose 3/8 non crimp or push on. This they will recognize. This stuff will be double walled ( fuel line unless fuel injection is single) and will have a fiber wrap in the walls. This is the stuff you are hunting. It will also have a spec on the printing on the cover. Napa or HD stores is your best bet. The autozones & advances won't have a clue.

In Napa land try Weatherhead / Eaton H10106 or H10006

http://www.eatonpowersource.com/cross-reference/details/h10106/
 
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juanprado

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NormB said:
If I had a hose full of nickels...

Specifically, if I had THIS hose: 6490610019

http://www.nsn-now.com/Indexing/PublicSearch.aspx

Which I didn’t, so after pouring over the web looking for one of any of branded part numbers listed, the ONLY one I could find was the stock part numbered hose and most everyone was out of stock. The GM part # 2410 has been superceded, and yeah, no one has that either.

I ordered the last roll from MacMotors. Need 12 feet (roughly), whole roll’s another $20, figured I’d sell it to someone who needed it down the road. Or wind up with CONEXes full of odds and ends for my estate sale someday.

NOTE the specs on the hose in question listed on nsn-now. Burst test 1000 psi, max operating pressure 250 lbs, material polyethylene. Am. General must’ve had some good reasons to go with this stuff.

FIgured I should buy what meets MILSPEC, right?

What I got in the mail yesterday was this:

View attachment 725272View attachment 725273View attachment 725274View attachment 725275

Clearly repackaged, and NOT the hose I’d ordered, not what’s labeled.

SAE 30R6 (and this took some doing) only has a working pressure of 20 PSI and has been superceded by 30R7 (50PSI, I think), again, not what I ordered, not what’s overkill-specified for the hydraulic/power steering pump lines.

I’m off today. I was going to replace all the hoses, bleed the system, and take my truck out for a ride, but now I’m going to print out the NSN-now spec sheet, head down to NAPA or Advance auto and ask them to find that hose - ONE of them - in their store room if they’ve got it.

Why is this so difficult? Should be easy to just by power steering hose. Maybe not so easy to by AMG spec’d hose, but geez, you’d figure searching with the part number on the web would give you (me) SOMEONE who has the right stuff.

I’ll call MacMotors in the AM, as for a return shipping label.

Bummer.
Click to expand...
That is regular fuel line that will never hold up in this app and guaranteed to fail....
 
NormB

NormB

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Action said:
The hydraulic hoses I have had were too hard to put a hose clamp on. They had to have fitting secured to the ends.
Click to expand...

Well, that’s where it gets really freaking interesting, you know?

The stock hoses are all the stiffer, reinforced stuff with a polyethyline liner (not nitrile) and they’re held in place with simple hose clamps.

The newer, higher pressure hydraulic hose, while metal/wire reinforced, has a nitrile (ie. - SOFTER) liner and need what kind of clamp?

This seems to be one more of “those things” regarding finding the right part for these machines where it’s NOT rocket science, it’s been done before, and I can’t find the easy, already done 1000 times solution (short of what General Hood and Juan Prado’s advised).

I keep making the mistake of assuming I can just find a part, a solution, out of all the thousands of these machines sold others have HAD to have redone this that or the other system and bought the material, but from whom among the dozens of parts sellers and what substitutions made to just buy the stuff.

Hummerparts guy shows the hose as discontinued - along with other sources - but call them for a possible substitute.

I CAN’T be the only guy who’s done this before. Hoses get old, polymers compress, work harden, harden from heat/chemical additives, lose sealant efficacy and need replacing.

I want to keep this simple, not have to rework everythign with fittings.

But thanks one and all. Just another in a seemingly near-endless stream of “snipe hunts.”

And here I thought I was so clever just ordering a spool of the stuff off Mac Motors so I could just do this one other thing and get on to something else.
 
NormB

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juanprado said:
When I see "wire" I assume it is crimp on fittings.
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Yeah, most likely.

I had stainless steel braided hose on a Norton 850 Commando many years ago cinched up with 1/4" hose clamps, didn't weep or anything.

I called around, no go for instock hose [FONT=&quot]H10106 Weatherhead 3/8 at NAPA or several other places, but I CAN order it in bulk (50 feet spool) and have it here in a couple days. That's about $2.90 delivered.
[/FONT]
Looks like I'll be selling 12 foot chunks here to recoup some of my expenses. I've already spent several hours on this, am still waiting to hear back from Mac Motors - called this AM, a supervisor is reviewing my email/photos/issue.

Issue being what I ordered and what I received are two entirely different things.

Anyone looking for some H10106 hose to redo their power steering system?
 
juanprado

juanprado

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NormB said:
Yeah, most likely.

I had stainless steel braided hose on a Norton 850 Commando many years ago cinched up with 1/4" hose clamps, didn't weep or anything.

I called around, no go for instock hose H10106 Weatherhead 3/8 at NAPA or several other places, but I CAN order it in bulk (50 feet spool) and have it here in a couple days. That's about $2.90 delivered.

Looks like I'll be selling 12 foot chunks here to recoup some of my expenses. I've already spent several hours on this, am still waiting to hear back from Mac Motors - called this AM, a supervisor is reviewing my email/photos/issue.

Issue being what I ordered and what I received are two entirely different things.

Anyone looking for some H10106 hose to redo their power steering system?
Click to expand...
I can probably buy it for you and ship it an envelope. It is normally stocked by me.
 
NormB

NormB

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juanprado said:
I can probably buy it for you and ship it an envelope. It is normally stocked by me.
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Thanks, Juan.

Having a bear of a time even finding this stuff in stock.

H10106 shows up as either discontinued, out of stock, can be ordered, and at prices from $2.50/foot delivered to almost $7.00, with several suppliers selling aftermarket (Chicom? Mexican? Who knows) hose WITH the WH part number. Not the same stuff.

I'll repost when I get word back from MM. so the truck sits for another week...
 
juanprado

juanprado

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NormB said:
Thanks, Juan.

Having a bear of a time even finding this stuff in stock.

H10106 shows up as either discontinued, out of stock, can be ordered, and at prices from $2.50/foot delivered to almost $7.00, with several suppliers selling aftermarket (Chicom? Mexican? Who knows) hose WITH the WH part number. Not the same stuff.

I'll repost when I get word back from MM. so the truck sits for another week...
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Napa by me has the H10106 (smooth rubber outer cover) for $4.99 ft and the H10006 (different outer cover - fiber woven )for $6.29. I can probably find a buddy to give it to me lower as those are retail prices over the counter and wholesale might be 20%-30% lower but it does depend on who I get on the counter as I am 15 years out of there and only a few folks I still know.
 
NormB

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juanprado said:
Napa by me has the H10106 (smooth rubber outer cover) for $4.99 ft and the H10006 (different outer cover - fiber woven )for $6.29. I can probably find a buddy to give it to me lower as those are retail prices over the counter and wholesale might be 20%-30% lower but it does depend on who I get on the counter as I am 15 years out of there and only a few folks I still know.
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The smooth stuff's on it now (PN 6490610019/12338957, stock part #s), should be fine, just want to start with good hose.

12 feet total. (23" + 41" + 45" + 29" with fudge factor), have the HP (blue) hose already.


I'll PM you, Juan. Got your paypal info.

Thanks.
 
NormB

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Action said:
Why not just go to a hydraulic shop and have pne made for $20? Take the two things that the assembly will attach to.
Click to expand...

Nothing personal, Action, but unless you start at the beginning of this thread, your comments are irrelevant to the conversation.

”the two things” would be the PS cooler, PS pump, and more. I’m just not up for the time/trouble/effort/expense of the crimped/swaged/fitted hose project and removing all those parts so the shop can make adapters/fittings.

Others must have replaced the stock part/hose before, I figured on this board one or several of them would jump right in and say “hey, I did that, and I have a roll of 200+ feet left of the stuff I can sell you” or, as was the case with Juan, “call NAPA and ask about this part number.”

I did better, I went online to the source, found the details of the individual hoses. Local NAPA was - as per usual - pretty useless.

DID find resellers, but minimum length of hose was 50ft.

But thanks anyway.
 
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NateTheGreat

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Year+ too late, but in the interest of good information I'll throw in $0.02 on this parade... HMMWV power steering return hose 6490610019 is similar to J189 spec, but has a slightly extended thermal rating of +150 deg. C on the high end. It calls out a working pressure of 250 psi, but that is only good if you have crimped or hydraulic hose fittings attached. When using plain hose clamps over a barbed fitting the working pressure is derated.

The hose to order where this hose is called for is Gates 349950. Which meets J189 + J2076 (high temp). It comes in 25' spools and you probably won't be finding it by the foot unless at a specialty hydraulic place.

Now on the output side I'll have to respond with a follow-up post with what hose I purchased. It isn't the same hose. The TM calls for a different hose and it has line fittings where yours was using a hose clamp. At least my M998 has fittings on that 90 degree passthrough for the rad shroud and if I recall that was per the drawings in the TM. The hose was higher pressure rated hydraulic hose too with a protective braid.

As a rule the HMMWV always uses extended temperature rated hoses. My engineering mind is OCD on getting the right parts and hoses are usually tricky. I ordered some vent hose for the geared hubs / DWF from an aviation supplier. Ya I'm crazy I know, but I've crossed referenced most of this stuff and found suitable replacement hoses all over the truck. I should prob just make a post with all flavors of replacement hoses for the whole truck for the betterment of mankind.
 
simp5782

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NateTheGreat said:
Year+ too late, but in the interest of good information I'll throw in $0.02 on this parade... HMMWV power steering return hose 6490610019 is similar to J189 spec, but has a slightly extended thermal rating of +150 deg. C on the high end. It calls out a working pressure of 250 psi, but that is only good if you have crimped or hydraulic hose fittings attached. When using plain hose clamps over a barbed fitting the working pressure is derated.

The hose to order where this hose is called for is Gates 349950. Which meets J189 + J2076 (high temp). It comes in 25' spools and you probably won't be finding it by the foot unless at a specialty hydraulic place.

Now on the output side I'll have to respond with a follow-up post with what hose I purchased. It isn't the same hose. The TM calls for a different hose and it has line fittings where yours was using a hose clamp. At least my M998 has fittings on that 90 degree passthrough for the rad shroud and if I recall that was per the drawings in the TM. The hose was higher pressure rated hydraulic hose too with a protective braid.

As a rule the HMMWV always uses extended temperature rated hoses. My engineering mind is OCD on getting the right parts and hoses are usually tricky. I ordered some vent hose for the geared hubs / DWF from an aviation supplier. Ya I'm crazy I know, but I've crossed referenced most of this stuff and found suitable replacement hoses all over the truck. I should prob just make a post with all flavors of replacement hoses for the whole truck for the betterment of mankind.
Click to expand...
Parker 831 hose is rated to 300psi/250 degrees and simply uses their push lok type fittings. not crimp on. The 836 hose variant is 250 psi and 315 degrees. Both of these hoses are 1000psi burst rated and do not require any crimp on fittings. They pushlok fittings are available with JIC ends as well.
 
DatGuyC

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I made custom PS lines for my corvette out of stainless braided Teflon lined hose I found on ebay. It said it was good up to 2500psi and 450 degrees F. I did have to use compression fittings but I figure I would do the same for the hummer if it ever needed it and would never have to worry about it again.
 
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NateTheGreat

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Parker 831 doesn't meet the temperature spec. 836 is a reasonable general purpose alternate to the gates # I provided at first glance...

As for my promised follow-up post the hose that goes from the output of the Cadillac valve to the Fan shroud I used gates 4C5C which meets up to all the pressure and temp specs and is readily available at a hyrd. hose shop. I reused the "field replaceable" JIC fittings off the old hose that was leaky to save a few bucks. You can order that entire new part w fittings pre-built. From the TM it is NSN: 4720-01-470-3076

As I said it isn't the same low pressure PS specific return hose on the other side of the valve and through the PS system. Gates C5C meets SAE 100R5 specs and rates @ 3000 psi working pressure which is what the NSN calls out.

Also the hose size drops here and so if you don't use the JIC fittings called out for in the TM you won't get the same amount of clamping tension on the small line than you do on the bigger lines and thus it may be more subject to come off under pressure as the OP experienced. You won't ever get anything near the rated pressure on the hoses without using JIC or some other captured fittings.

Just make sure to build it per the drawing unless you know your substitute solution is better. Sure the general hoses at the auto store will work on some cases, but they are never rated to the actual specs.
 
simp5782

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NateTheGreat said:
Parker 831 doesn't meet the temperature spec. 836 is a reasonable general purpose alternate to the gates # I provided at first glance...

As for my promised follow-up post the hose that goes from the output of the Cadillac valve to the Fan shroud I used gates 4C5C which meets up to all the pressure and temp specs and is readily available at a hyrd. hose shop. I reused the "field replaceable" JIC fittings off the old hose that was leaky to save a few bucks. You can order that entire new part w fittings pre-built. From the TM it is NSN: 4720-01-470-3076

As I said it isn't the same low pressure PS specific return hose on the other side of the valve and through the PS system. Gates C5C meets SAE 100R5 specs and rates @ 3000 psi working pressure which is what the NSN calls out.

Also the hose size drops here and so if you don't use the JIC fittings called out for in the TM you won't get the same amount of clamping tension on the small line than you do on the bigger lines and thus it may be more subject to come off under pressure as the OP experienced. You won't ever get anything near the rated pressure on the hoses without using JIC or some other captured fittings.

Just make sure to build it per the drawing unless you know your substitute solution is better. Sure the general hoses at the auto store will work on some cases, but they are never rated to the actual specs.
Click to expand...
Parker hose is good to 212 degrees. If the system is running over 170 degrees you have issues
 
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