M813 Batteries / Charging

Iceman3005 · May 6, 2018

Ok, I have checked TM's, and I am stumped on this one. Starter clicks when I try and start. If I jump it with the cucv, it fires right up. I let truck run for an hour to charge batteries. While truck is running I checked voltage at batteries. It was at 25 volts, according to TM voltage is to low. Should be at 28 volts. So I checked voltage at the alternator, it is reading 14.5 volts. Checked TM, it said to check wires, battery terminals, voltage regulator, alternator, control box. Wires are good, terminals are good (tight with no corrosion). NO voltage regulator on fire wall above air horns. Alternator looks different than the one in TM.

So here is where I am stumped. The alternator in the TM looks completely different then the alternator on my truck, also where the voltage regulator is supposed to be on the fire wall above the air horns it is NOT there.

Shouldn't I be getting 28 volts of from the alternator?

Iceman3005 · May 6, 2018

With truck off I am getting 25 volts at the batteries, and 25 volts at the starter. But I am assuming since I am not getting the 28 volts while truck is running that its not putting enough charge in them to start the truck. The starter just clicks.

Evil Dr. Porkchop · May 6, 2018

That's not a stock alternator. How long have you had this truck? What voltage are the batteries at when you test them individually? Maybe they've got a 12 volt alternator hooked up to just one battery.

Iceman3005 · May 6, 2018

Just bought it about 2 weeks ago. Only getting 12.5 volts on the one battery (12 volt side) with truck running.

98G · May 6, 2018

That's bizarre.

It's not plausible that Steve put a 12v alternator in it....

Edit - PM sent

Iceman3005 · May 6, 2018

I see he has alternator belts in the classified's, but I don't see an actual alternator?

Iceman3005 · May 6, 2018

Talking with Steve, he said it is part number 7197N. Checked that part number and it is a 24 volt alternator. local part store sells them, they look just like a civilian alternator.

swbradley1 · May 6, 2018

Yes, it seems as though the one I put on the truck was a 12V instead of a 24V like was SOLD to me by psep.biz. It had the spec sheet with test results in it say it tested at 24V up to 80Amps.

I'm shipping Jeff a new replacement.

steve

Iceman3005 · May 6, 2018

Thanks Steve!!!

mdainsd · May 9, 2018

swbradley1 said:
Yes, it seems as though the one I put on the truck was a 12V instead of a 24V like was SOLD to me by psep.biz. It had the spec sheet with test results in it say it tested at 24V up to 80Amps.

I'm shipping Jeff a new replacement.

steve

There's a gentleman for you!

Iceman3005 · May 19, 2018

Got the new alternator installed, batteries had volts but low amps. Had them on the trickle charger all night, but still had low amps, so I figured the low voltage shorted the batteries out. So I bought and installed group D4 batteries!

swbradley1 · May 19, 2018

A trickle charger would not charge batteries that low, you must use a full on charger for them. Just like if the batteries were that low you can't jump them with a truck and expect the alternator to charge them up, they won't. All dead batteries will is smoke the alternator, I've had it happen twice trying to start a dead truck. You must use a charger on the batteries, not trickle.

Sorry it happened but you should be good now.

sandcobra164 · May 19, 2018

I agree with Steve, a trickle charger will not revive batteries of this size overnight. Maybe my motorcycle or lawnmower battery if I'm lucky. I have had Hawker 6TAGM's take 2 days of charging at 10 amps each to recover after leaving the lights on for a few days to regain the capacity to turn over the Deuce engine fast enough to fire off. I've also learned from 74M35A2 that discharged batteries are extremely hard on an alternator. He broke it down to me Barney style and gave me a big thumbs up when I put some new batteries in my M923.

Iceman3005 · May 19, 2018

I have been charging batteries for 30 years. A dead battery requires a trickle charge. If you try and cram tons of amps into a dead battery you will just fry the plates even more. My battery supplier can confirm this. I think they know more than anyone since they are the manufacturer.

Wasn't going to do this, but nothing pisses me off more than people that cut corners and use cheap crap. First you installed cheap refurbished batteries on a truck that requires lots of amps to start. I called autozone the supplier of those cheap pieces of junk "Econo Power" batteries and they are 69 dollars with no warranty, why do they not have a warranty? Because there junk to begin with. Why on earth would you use cheap junk batteries. I just put 1000 dollars into a decent set of batteries that should last 15 years if not more.

Then the Alternator you installed was junk which fried the batteries which where also junk to begin with, then the one you sent me only puts out 25 volts at an idle and 27 volts at 1500. Been working on military vehicles for 20 years, all off them put or 28.5 volts whether at an idle or a higher rpm. So I ordered the correct alternator that is the OE that will put out the correct voltage, that cost me another 800 dollars.

When I tested amps one battery had 140 amps, the other had 200. Put both on the charger for 12 hours. After 12 hours both batteries had less amps than when I put them on the charger. Called my supplier, he said batteries shorted out. Then he asked what brand, I told him and he just laughed and said "those are the cheapest pieces of junk out there"!

Moral of the story, don't cut corners and go cheap just to save a buck or two.

simp5782 · May 20, 2018

Iceman3005 said:
I have been charging batteries for 30 years. A dead battery requires a trickle charge. If you try and cram tons of amps into a dead battery you will just fry the plates even more. My battery supplier can confirm this. I think they know more than anyone since they are the manufacturer.

Wasn't going to do this, but nothing pisses me off more than people that cut corners and use cheap crap. First you installed cheap refurbished batteries on a truck that requires lots of amps to start. I called autozone the supplier of those cheap pieces of junk "Econo Power" batteries and they are 69 dollars with no warranty, why do they not have a warranty? Because there junk to begin with. Why on earth would you use cheap junk batteries. I just put 1000 dollars into a decent set of batteries that should last 15 years if not more.

Then the Alternator you installed was junk which fried the batteries which where also junk to begin with, then the one you sent me only puts out 25 volts at an idle and 27 volts at 1500. Been working on military vehicles for 20 years, all off them put or 28.5 volts whether at an idle or a higher rpm. So I ordered the correct alternator that is the OE that will put out the correct voltage, that cost me another 800 dollars.

When I tested amps one battery had 140 amps, the other had 200. Put both on the charger for 12 hours. After 12 hours both batteries had less amps than when I put them on the charger. Called my supplier, he said batteries shorted out. Then he asked what brand, I told him and he just laughed and said "those are the cheapest pieces of junk out there"!

Moral of the story, don't cut corners and go cheap just to save a buck or two.

Then that would be your little secret. To revive a dead 6TL alot of us leave em in trickle charges for weeks. They come back to life then and they are beyond dead on almost all trucks we recover off bases.

If you spent $1000 on two D4s then you got had. Pretty bad. Two hawkers would probably last you 15years if taken care of and that would have been under $600. Batteries are made by 1 of 3 companies in this country. The battery/charging guru will be along shortly to scold you as soon as hes done playing with his cardboard weapons shield.

Hate to tell you this but my dash meter only says 27.4 volts at idle or at 2000rpms and that is with a brushless alternator along with several other trucks. When that OE alternator blows out then the battery/charge in guru can sell you an alternator. Guess my Duracell batteries are too cheap to get to 28volts.

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Iceman3005 · May 20, 2018

Only 3 manufactures? ABS Alaskan Inc. , Advanced Battery Concepts, Alaska Battery Manufacturing, Antique Auto Battery, Atlantic Battery Corp, Axion Power International Inc

Thats just the "A" U.S. manufactures! you want me to list them all from "A-Z"?

Iceman3005 · May 20, 2018

"A to Z" Battery Builders Inc. Battery Specialties,Best Battery LLC,Braille Battery, Bulldog Battery, C&D Technologies Inc.,Cell-Con Inc.,Commercial Battery,Continental Battery Mfg. Co., Crown Battery Mfg. Co.,Delphi Automotive,Douglas Battery Mfg. Co.,Dyno Battery, Eagle-Picher Technologies,East Penn Manufacturing Co. EBCO Battery Co.Energy Technologies,Energy Technologies, Inc.,GNBFirefly Energy Inc.,Gill Electric Company, Global Control Systems, Hawker Powersource, Illinois Battery Mfg. Co., Imarflex Battery Mfg. Corp.,Innergy Power Corp,,Keystone,Laor Industrial Batteries,Millennium Battery Co.,MK Battery Co.,Mule Emergency Lighting, Inc.,Optima Batteries Inc.,Pietro Standby Power, Inc.,Portable Energy Products, Power Battery Co.,Power Resources,Powersafe Standby Batteries,Power-SonicPower Technology Inc., Power-Troll,Powersafe Standby Batteries Inc.,Service Battery Corp,Spyke,Staab Battery Mfg. Co.,State Battery Co.,Storage Battery SystemsTamarac International,eledyne Continental Motors,Thermodymanics Reactor,Texford Battery Co.,Boa Tong USA, Trojan Battery Co., U.S. Battery Mfg. Co.,VMAX USA, LLC,Voltmaster Corp.,Yuasa Battery Inc.

That's just the U.S.

simp5782 · May 20, 2018

Like I said. That's just going to be your little secret. Well you have 30yrs experience charging batteries and military truck expierence for 20yrs. Sounds like this thread should not have lended you any helpful information from other members with all that under your belt.

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162tcat · May 20, 2018

Iceman3005 said:
"A to Z" Battery Builders Inc. Battery Specialties,Best Battery LLC,Braille Battery, Bulldog Battery, C&D Technologies Inc.,Cell-Con Inc.,Commercial Battery,Continental Battery Mfg. Co., Crown Battery Mfg. Co.,Delphi Automotive,Douglas Battery Mfg. Co.,Dyno Battery, Eagle-Picher Technologies,East Penn Manufacturing Co. EBCO Battery Co.Energy Technologies,Energy Technologies, Inc.,GNBFirefly Energy Inc.,Gill Electric Company, Global Control Systems, Hawker Powersource, Illinois Battery Mfg. Co., Imarflex Battery Mfg. Corp.,Innergy Power Corp,,Keystone,Laor Industrial Batteries,Millennium Battery Co.,MK Battery Co.,Mule Emergency Lighting, Inc.,Optima Batteries Inc.,Pietro Standby Power, Inc.,Portable Energy Products, Power Battery Co.,Power Resources,Powersafe Standby Batteries,Power-SonicPower Technology Inc., Power-Troll,Powersafe Standby Batteries Inc.,Service Battery Corp,Spyke,Staab Battery Mfg. Co.,State Battery Co.,Storage Battery SystemsTamarac International,eledyne Continental Motors,Thermodymanics Reactor,Texford Battery Co.,Boa Tong USA, Trojan Battery Co., U.S. Battery Mfg. Co.,VMAX USA, LLC,Voltmaster Corp.,Yuasa Battery Inc.

That's just the U.S.

If this is going to become a pissing contest, might as well shut this down now. And for the record, the vast majority of "battery manufacturers" you quoted above don't manufacture batteries at all or have some niche market they serve such as solar or ups, not automotive. Optima is made by Johnson Controls for example, they are just a brand. But does it really matter? Nope. Kinda like running full Amsoil in your old military truck vs cheap Delo 400 or even some off brand of diesel motor oil. All will get the job done.

Alternator had a problem, agreed. Do you need to spend $1000 on super huge high end batteries for an old rusty military truck hobby? No. Will econopower or any other decent battery do the job? Yes. Lots of opinions here (mine included) so it's probably best that we all agree to disagree.

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WillWagner · May 20, 2018

^^I agree.

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