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Thread: M923A0 coolant in oil ... it's rebuild time for me!

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillWagner View Post
    ... use a cooling system pressurizing tool and put 15 or so PSI on it and watch where the drips come from
    That was Step #2, after dropping the pan! ;-}

    Thanks!

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    Colonel Ajax MD's Avatar
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    Manders, I found this video for us "visual learners." It's our engine and the fellow states it's from a 5 ton, but not sure if it's an 809 or 900 series truck.

    Motorpool:

    (Isn't owning one of this insanity enough??)
    1971 M813 "Ox" (named for Dewey Oxburger)

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    I'm the dude, man. Steel Soldiers Vendor simp5782's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajax MD View Post
    Manders, I found this video for us "visual learners." It's our engine and the fellow states it's from a 5 ton, but not sure if it's an 809 or 900 series truck.

    He is a member here Acme66. We wont discuss why those engines were being rebuilt though
    2008 F-250 6.4L Powerstroke
    1984 AM General M923A1 ( Big Cam III NTC-400, HT3B turbo, Intercooled, #15 button, Dual fuel Line setup - MRAP Aluminum Radiator - 8" Ram Air Intake system - Dual 115 gallon tanks - Air Conditioning - 145amp alternator - Puradyn Oil Bypass system, CAT 7155 16speed transmission, Oshkosh 55000 Transfer Case, riding on 16.00 AT-3s on HEMTT wheels. )
    83' M923A1
    M796 Bolster
    M322 Equipment Trailer
    MEP-804A


    901-318-8353 for Help in and or around the Memphis area or transporting in the southeast. Text me first before calling.

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    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCTd...D4dOJidPFnmYGA

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    manders (12-06-2018)

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    Colonel Ajax MD's Avatar
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    Ah, yes I recall that thread. Regardless of why the engines are dying, seeing one taken apart and its constituent pieces was really helpful for me.
    I've rebuilt V-8 gasoline engines but this is a whole 'nother level.
    Motorpool:

    (Isn't owning one of this insanity enough??)
    1971 M813 "Ox" (named for Dewey Oxburger)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajax MD View Post
    ... seeing one taken apart and its constituent pieces was really helpful for me.
    I've rebuilt V-8 gasoline engines but this is a whole 'nother level.
    Same story for me!

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    I'm the dude, man. Steel Soldiers Vendor simp5782's Avatar
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    It is pretty simple process.. no different than building a V8 everything is just bigger.

    I can send you a take out motor that is known good for what you are gonna spend on a rebuild kit. Only takes 3hrs to have an engine out and another 3 or so to have it back in and running on a 939 series truck. The hardest part is screwing with the hood. everything else is cake.
    2008 F-250 6.4L Powerstroke
    1984 AM General M923A1 ( Big Cam III NTC-400, HT3B turbo, Intercooled, #15 button, Dual fuel Line setup - MRAP Aluminum Radiator - 8" Ram Air Intake system - Dual 115 gallon tanks - Air Conditioning - 145amp alternator - Puradyn Oil Bypass system, CAT 7155 16speed transmission, Oshkosh 55000 Transfer Case, riding on 16.00 AT-3s on HEMTT wheels. )
    83' M923A1
    M796 Bolster
    M322 Equipment Trailer
    MEP-804A


    901-318-8353 for Help in and or around the Memphis area or transporting in the southeast. Text me first before calling.

    Tires (HMMWV, 395s, 1600s) and Transportation Vendor

    Wes

    Videos at https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=5782simp

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCTd...D4dOJidPFnmYGA

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    Moderator WillWagner's Avatar
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    Use a propane torch to lightly heat the pistons instead of freezing the pin, water from condensation can attack the upper wrist pin bushing, BC rods work well in SC engines, they have a much smaller failure rate and with the oil hole moved off center, better oiling.

    Trouble shoot it first.....
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  12. #28
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    More info, some good, some confusing ...

    We got the pan dropped and there is nothing but near-microscopic metal particles, i.e., no big chunks of liner material, o-rings, etc., just some small pieces of silicone gasket sealer, which I didn't think too much of, seeing as it was used to join the sections of the oil pan gasket.

    OilPan01.jpgOilPan02.jpg

    A visual inspection of the bottom end didn't show much, and a pressure test didn't provoke a Niagara Falls, so we then started taking apart the top.

    With every "layer" we peeled apart, my mechanic helper (remember: he knows more about these engines than I do! ) keeps saying "these parts are brand new!!!".

    We got the heads off and all the pistons look just fine, no apparent cracks on the sleeves, and a "fingernail test" on the liners didn't detect any scoring.

    Cyl1And2.jpgCyl3And4.jpgCyl5And6.jpg

    When we lifted the head gasket off, my friend was very surprised when he saw a not-insignificant amount of gasket sealer/maker.

    Piston5GasketSealer.jpgPiston6GasketSealer.jpg

    While he is relatively new to the field, he was pretty sure that it was not "normal" to put anything between a metal gasket and the metal block. He called his old boss, buckets more experience, years on-the-job, etc., and he agreed, speculating that maybe somebody thought the block was warped and they figured that putting silly-cone down would make a better seal.

    (We also took the oil cooler apart, and found some more of this material trapped in the element, meaning that it circulated pretty much all over the place.)

    So now the $64K question is whether this is the root-cause of the underlying problem, or just a symptom of a problem we haven't yet discovered.


    While he took a little trip to the local tool supply to get a mechanic's edge so we can see if there is any ***obvious*** warping ... I figured I'd upload some pics and ask for a bit more of the "wisdom of the crowd".

    As usual, any and all guidance is greatly appreciated.

    MAnders.
    Last edited by manders; 12-14-2018 at 15:53.

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    Colonel Ajax MD's Avatar
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    Ah, the game's afoot! The vets here weren't lying when they said not to make assumptions and troubleshoot.

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    The head gaskets do not seal on the deck. They only seal at the liner, the thin bead around it, BE CAREFUL when cleaning the block so you do not remove/knick the fire ring....and at the coolant grommets...the little white rings that are stuck to the deck, and the oil passage rubbers. See those fiber white rings? One of the things to look for when a head gasket is thought to be a problem, is to look at those grommets AFTER you pull a head. The grommets SHOULD stick to both the head and the deck, the grommet rips in half when the head/gasket is removed. Those were not sealing. No type of sealant should be put anywhere on the head gaskets or surfaces....for that matter on ANY cummins supplied gasket...NO SEALANT, except for puzzle piece pan and gear cover gaskets, only a silicone based adhesive on the joints of the gasket.

    Was what was in the oil coolant or plain water? I ask because if the engine has antifreeze in it and the liquid that made the oil milky isn't antifreeze, that means it is water most likely introduced by a loose/missing oil filler cap, dipstick or by contaminated oil. When in doubt, taste the condensation. Sweet = antifreeze, unless it is red antifreeze, then it is bitter. No taste, tastes like oil = water.
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