Painting questions

I have about half of my M211 painted and am getting ready to paint the rest and I was just wondering how you guys mix your paint. I started out by stripping the old paint off the truck down to the first layers, then I sand it all, scuff it up, wash it down to remove the dust and stripper residue, and wipe down with Naptha. Once it dries I thin my red oxide primer with Naptha 2:1, put on about 3 coats, then do the same with the 23070 gillespie. On the rear end I did not use any hardner and the paint looks very good, but my local auto body guy told me I should use hardner with the rest of the truck so I bought some PPG brand hardner for enamels. My question was is this pretty much how you guys prep and paint your trucks or is there something I'm doing wrong here. The paint looks good and nothing peels ect. I am thinking i'm going to try the hardner though from now on. I even read somewhere that one of the guys here said he thinned his paint with primer??? I was really confused by that. Any help on this would be much appreciated.

Here is the post from Low Tech Redneck on the thinning with primer???
"Gillespie 34086 "383" CARC-Substitute, in gallon buckets, thinned w/ primer and put on w/ a spray gun."

hmm must be a miss type he used mineral spirits to thin it(I'm more or less sure) but Naptha's fine too
aside from the stripper your doing it about the same as everyone else that used Gillespie.

YEah, mistype on my part, it was thinned w/ mineral spirits, just whatever off-the-shelf paint thinner from Lowe's was cheap and available

The prep work was sanding down the old layers of paint untill all the jagged edges were gone, and any sloppy brush strokes worked off, then we put on red oxide primer/rustproofer that we got from the Eastwood company, once that had a chance to cure, we just applied the Gillespie in coats untill it all looked uniform, most of the truck took 2 coats, the occasional stubborn spot took a 3rd or 4th before we were happy with the results, once the paint dried, we stenciled it up, and that's how it is today

I powerwashed mine then painted it. I was in a hurry and anything was better than the horrible yellow (looked like Kennys M10. Its still on there.

Gillespie is a synthetic enamel and SHOULD be used with synthetic enamel hardener and synthetic enamel reducer...

You COULD proably thin it with gasoline if you WANTED TO... but that doesn't mean you SHOULD....

Its up to the person and the end result you want... It all pretty much looks the same in the beginning, hardener will help it look better longer by protecting against chips and scratches, helps bonding and helps hold the color.

With this subject its 6 to one guy and a half dozen to the next guy you talk to... When you compare this stuff to 300$ a gallon products its apples and oranges in performance. However.... It does not hurt to spend the minimal amount of money needed to buy the SUGGESTED additives and give the cheap stuff a better chance at looking better for longer...

If it saves anyone time - The base coats on the military trucks in the western states (besides OR & WA) are in pretty darn good shape. If you have one of those non-rustmasters, it saves time to sand/grind/smooth only the bad stuff and feather any chips. The new paint will go right over quite nicely.

However, I totally agree, you need to spend the extra $ on the hardner and reducer... Only paint it once and get it over with, don't set yourself up for a re-paint 3 years down the road (or less).

Good luck, that's a lot of shooting. Please post pics!

I read on here some time back that if you use hardner you then need to add flatner???
any one know the proper mix???
I tooo think that as much work as it takes to do a good paint job on one of these bests its best to do it right the frist time. I getting ready to repaint my M135. going to have it sandblasted it sat a long time and rodeants made their home in it alot of rust but no rust holes.

I called Gillespie and they suggested to thin with Xylene.(sp) Also I have a question, do you use hardner on the prime coat?


Tony

No hardener in a prime coat unless you are using a primer which requires it (epoxy, high build, etc)... With Gillespie you need to make sure your using a SYNTHETIC ENAMEL HARDENER you don't have to buy the PPG brand, a generic will suffice with this stuff just fine and usually save a few bucks. On the reducer Im still saying stick with a syn/enam reducer ESPECIALLY when using a hardener, god knows what you might get otherwise.... just my humble opinion.

You should not need a flattening agent, you MAY however see a difference between parts if your mixing hardened and unhardened painted parts.

Free advice is only worth what you pay for it, but the following is based on experience.

I've painted a lot of trucks with a lot of different paints. I have used Gillespie exclusively for over 25 years. As a testimonial, and you cannot find a more demanding environment that the sun out here, it will outlast anything this side of CARC. The sun will take the paint off a new truck in less than two years here.

My old M37 was last done in '87 in 24087, and it still looks OK with NO garage time.

They (Gillespie) say use Xylene as a thinner, and not to add anthing else as you WILL upset the fade/wear properties. I believe them, like "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"

I have seen trucks done up with "hardened" Gillespie, Sherwin-Williams, R-M, Acme, Aervoe (junk),and Rustoleum. None of them look any better, most don't look as good even when new.

The apparent fact is you can't do any better by having it mixed at some automotive paint outlet (unless it is free) or buying any other brand of pre-colored military color paint.

Rapco in Texas will sell it to you delivered, cheaper by the case than one gallon of auto shop paint.

The most important thing to remember is the surface has to be free of rust before you prime it with real red oxide, not making it too smooth so the topcoat will have something to hold on to.

Mix the topcoat about 2:1, air about 30 PSI, and do your shooting from 70 to 100 degrees for a decent outcome.

dg

devilman 96,
thanks for the input on no hardner for the prime coat,appriciate that.
I use Gillespie.

Now mr Commodore,
did you state not to use hardner on the top coat, I was a little confused when I read your response.
Also I do understand to use hardner for synthetic enamel, which Gillespie is.

thanks,
Tony

...... just kiddin!

What Commodore is saying is don't bother using hardener at all he has had great results over the years with out it... The "top coat" reference he is making is the "paint" itself... Usually the term is used when spraying 2 stage finishes like base coat / clear coat... More often the clear coat is referred to as top coat because it is the final coating the car/truck gets not the last coat of paint you decide to spray.

The top coat ratio he is recommending is to simply mix 2 parts paint to one part Xylene using no hardener... It can also be said as 2 gallons paint to 1 gallon hardener...

If you do use hardener... Its goes in the paint... only the paint... and all of the paint you plan on spraying (1st, 2nd, 3rd + coats)...

I would recommend using a ratio of 8:3:1. This means 8 parts of paint to 3 parts thinner to 1 part hardener... It can also be said as 8 quarts of paint - 3 quart thinner - 1 quart hardener... Basically it is the same ratio Commodore is recommending only you are substituting the 1 quart of hardener for one of the quarts of thinner...

Spray it at 35-45 PSI provided you are using a suction feed type spray gun, if you are using something else to apply it your on your own.

All ratios of course are approximate ratios and should be tested on a spot panel before applying it to the actual vehicle. If the mix is to thick or to thin add a little thinner or paint accordingly. If you are REALLY unsure about your mixing and spraying ability you can purchase a viscosity cup from a local paint supplier and test the viscosity (thickness) of your paint while mixing. Ask the guys at the counter to explane how to use it and what viscosity to look for a "single stage synthetic enamel"...

Hope this helps...

*thinkin should do a picture tutorial when I paint my truck in the next two months*