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Calling all Generator Owners

Speddmon

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Attention all generator owners who frequently help out on the site...and others who want to chime in.

It's been brought up before that we need to have a central informative thread about what to look for when purchasing a generator and the initial steps that really should get done after you bring one home before you try to fire it up. Thanks to LuckyDog we have the wonderfully informative MEP 002A and 003A WIKI article. But even he has acknowledged in the past that this is one area of the WIKI that is lacking.

What I want to do now that I have the power is to get all of the ideas from you guys about what you would look for when purchasing a generator especially from GL. And what you would recomment be done FIRST thing after you get it home. As well as helpful tips for new owners that they should know/do to keep their new purchase running and happy. After I get the information from all of you guys in this thread, I'm going to consolidate all of that info along with the WIKI link, and links to all of the TM's for the various generators we have on SS and put tham all in one "sticky" at the very top of our auxiliary equipment forum. So, lets get the ball rolling shall we...
 
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Speddmon

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First and Foremost

After you purchase and get your generator running...NEVER, NEVER Idle the engine!!!
 

steelandcanvas

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The first thing that came to mind was:
Download the proper TM for you new machine.
Next was:
Go completely through the fuel system, clean and change fuel, oil, and air filters, and tighten all fittings.
And then:
Inspect, and then inspect some more, and when you get done with that, inspect again.
More:
Use a fuel additive, and keep her topped off. She might set awhile before uses.
Never, ever idle her down.
This, by all means is not a complete list, see your friendly TM for more information.

:doghead: :drool:
 

Isaac-1

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This sounds like a worthy project, and I hope it will develop into a resource we can point people to when they show up for the moment I will focus on advice regarding the first step which is identification and buying, first regarding GL.

In general GL auction descriptions can lack detail and often be incorrect on such things as model numbers, the good news is this seems to be due to lack of attention to detail on the part of the person listing the item, and is unlikely to be due to intentional deception. (this is not true of ebay auctions, etc. where people have been known to switch out cover panels, meters, etc to pass off 400 hz useless paperweights as useful 60 hz units), so the key here is make sure the description matches the actual item, also if you can inspect in person so much the better, as sometimes GL will list items with the wrong photos attached particularly when there are large lots of similar units listed.

Be aware that condition codes and hour meters don't always give you an indication of the condition of a generator, hour meters may show low hours because it never ran right, or the meter may have been changed out on a high hour unit when it stopped running. Condition codes are even worse, I would go so far as to say they are useless, I have bought several items listed as HX or scrap that were either fully functional or only needed minor repair (a good example of this is a lot of 4 HX code floor jacks I bought, 2- 4 ton and 2- 10 ton, 3 of the 4 were fully functional, the last one someone had twisted the steel release rod inside the handle into a corkscrew, how they applied enough leverage to do this I have no idea). The lesson to learn from this, is to carefully inspect photo's videos, and if possible the unit in person, look for missing parts, this can be signs of a dead unit that was used for parts, or at the very least some of these missing parts can be expensive or hard to locate.

Before you bid/buy make sure you read the fine print, where is the unit located, what are the access terms, does the site offer loading assistance, often you will see items at a remote site mixed in with the listing that are located at a manned GL site, remember if you do win you have very limited time to arrange for pickup. Also before you bid be aware you are buying AS-IS, and even if you get lucky and get a runner (based on the general experience around here these can account for about 50% of the good looking GL generators) you will still likely have to invest in fresh batteries, filters, oil, etc. Then there is that other 50% which may range from requiring minor work, on up to being good only for parts or a paperweight.

Next is a rundown on commonly seen generator models that are useful for general personal use / standby power, etc. I will limit this to the 1.5 - 30KW size range MEP series generators (All military KW ratiings are ultra conservative and are continuous load ratings in extreme environments, which should not be confused with the peak ratings seen on consumer generators) , if your looking for anything bigger than this you likely known what your doing, or you should. The MEP sereis is the standard military generator series adopted in the late 1960's when the DOD realized that logistic support for the vast number of models they had been buying prior to that was not practical.


First off the gasoline units (these have the potential of being converted to run on natural gas or propane)

These are all Viet Nam era designs and were designed when little thought was given to fuel economy
They are the

1.5KW MEP-015 -1.5KW 3600 rpm generator, basic simple, good for a couple of KW will keep the refrigerator and a few lights and fans running in a power outage as long as you can feed it.

3KW MEP-016A o MEP-016C - 3 KW 3600 rpm generator, can supply 1 or 3 phase power (120,240,120-208 3 phase) There is also the MEP-016b Diesel version of this unit powered by a 1 cylinder Onan built in the 1980's, as well and the MEP-016D and MEP-016E, the MEP-016D is an A or C gasoline uint that has been retrofitted with an L70 Yanmar Diesel as a life extension program (note many of these will retain their original labels and may be listed on GL as gasoline generators), the MEP-016E is a B series Onan Diesel that has been retrofitted with an L100 Yanmar Diesel. These yanmar powered units may represent the lowest cost of ownership military surplus generators as they are powered by current production model enginge and many parts are easily available. The MEP-016b is also available as the MEP-701a which is just a MEP-016b in an ASK housing

5KW MEP-017 3600 rpm gasoline generator, ( I don;t know much about them, but think they have the same 1 or 3 phase voltage options as the MEP-016 family), one thing is for sure their 4 cylinder military standard engines will drink lots of fuel.

10KW MEP-018 gasoline generator much like the others, very thrursty

Now for the Diesels:

3 KW MEP-016B MEP-016D, and MEP-016E (see mention above in the gasoline generator section)

5KW MEP-002a 1800 rpm diesel genrator powered by the venerable Onan J series 2 cylinder diesel engine, you will find these built by multple contractors, (Libby, Onan, etc.) all are built from the same parts and at this point after numerous rebuilds are likely mix-and match anyway. These also have reconnection switches to output 120V,240V or 120/208 3 phase. Sometimes they will show up for sale with theASK sound kit option installed, these tend to draw higher prices since all the MEP series diesel are notorious for being LOUD.

10KW MEP-003 Big brother of the MEP-002a except powed by a 4 cylinder Onan J series engine, same other comments apply, largest MEP series generator designed to offer single phase power

15KW MEP-004 requires wiring modification to run in single phase mode, generally considered to be too large for most personal / home standby use engines have a bit of a reputation for wet stacking when ran at light loads

30KW MEP-005 - see MEP-004 info.

Vintage units, there were numerous models built prior to the introduction of the MEP series in the late 1960's, as a general rule these should probably only be considered by those interested in vintage engines and equipment

The MB sereis, the MB sereis of generators were units built for the Air Force from the late 1960's through early 1980's in general avoid all of them, they had overly complicated control systems, and were designed like Air Force planes of the time to make them easy to service by aircraft mechanics using standard aircraft components, this makes parts for them very hard to get and very expensive.

Anything not listed above will likely be exotic or a relatively usesless 400 hz (only good for aircraft , missile and radar systems) or 28V battery charging APU generator.

Ike
 
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trukhead

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First and Foremost

After you purchase and get your generator running...NEVER, NEVER Idle the engine!!!

What happens if the unit is idled for an engine warm up?

I warm up a 5 kw B&S civi-cheapy unit for a few seconds to get the oil splashin around in the engine before I let'er rip with the electric zip gun.

What damage or overload am I subjecting the electrics on the generator to?


:shock:
 

Speddmon

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El-cheapo voltage regulators are usually capacitor regulators, not the field modulation ones like the military uses, so on that one you are probably not doing any damage. Frankly, I am surprised it has a throttle on it at all, most civi generators start and are governed right up to operating speed and that's it.
 

DieselBob

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Isaac-1, don't forget the MEP-018. GENERATOR SET, GASOLINE ENGINE DRIVEN, SKID
MOUNTED, TUBULAR FRAME, 10 KW, AC, 120/208 V, 3 PHASE:
AND 120/240 V SINGLE PHASE.
 

Isaac-1

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Thanks for the reminder, I don't know much about them other than it seems everyone that has one is looking for parts to make it run. It seems like someone on here has been through 3 or 4 generator ends trying to find a good one.
 

coyote62ny

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how about putting the filter numbers in here for all the gen sets to make them easy to find for the new gen set owners. mep-002 and mep-003 oil filter ch6pl fuel filter c1125pl .
 

trukhead

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El-cheapo voltage regulators are usually capacitor regulators, not the field modulation ones like the military uses, so on that one you are probably not doing any damage. Frankly, I am surprised it has a throttle on it at all, most civi generators start and are governed right up to operating speed and that's it.
I doesn't have a throttle, I just finger the throttle butterfly on the carburetor after it starts popping and I hold it to fast idle for a few seconds till the head blow tepid warm air.:whistle:
 

trukhead

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El-cheapo voltage regulators are usually capacitor regulators, not the field modulation ones like the military uses, so on that one you are probably not doing any damage. Frankly, I am surprised it has a throttle on it at all, most civi generators start and are governed right up to operating speed and that's it.


Therefore, idling a military unit will: cause the field modulation regulator to install too much current into the fields allowing the fields to burn out and perhaps the energy part of the regulator circuit?... I'm just hypothesizing, I have no ability to work on electronic circuits. I took a circuit analysis class once and find this stuff fascinating and if I find some schematics, I might try to do some cipherin and such. I want a pristine example of a late model 002 and I am trying to get skooled up them.
This and other threads on the Mil generators are fascinating as all get out!:)
 

Speddmon

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It won't necessarily burn out the field, but it will eventually damage the voltage regulator and or the bridge rectifier board. Because as you said, it's trying to pump too much current into the field to make the voltage

TM 5-6115-585-34, Page 1-9, figure 1-1 is the generator schematic. And page 6-13, figure 6-5 is the schematic for the voltage regulator.
 

Speddmon

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Come on guys, let's get this back on topic. I appreciate the side discussions, and that is why I'm not using this thread for the sticky. I also appreciate the tips we got from Ike, Jonathan, Bob and Coyote, but I thought more people would have chimed in by now (Kip, your suggestions was a good one too, just not practical).
 

3dAngus

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Has anyone ever developed a list, long or short, of what parts are interchangeable between the Mep-003 and 002? It would be nice to see it added to the Wiki thread.
 

Speddmon

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IIRC there is a tech bulletin or something out there that was posted on SS at one time with an interchange list. Basically, electrically, everything is the same with the exception of the main breaker, generator head and engine wire harness (too short due to the length of the engine).
 

trukhead

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I will try to get on topic and use thread etiquette.

What to look for when contemplating a fresh generator purchase.

If making this purchase from a private party, does the generator:

Run
check the oil and coolant
is present owner willing to run it
is it possible to load test it

If from GL or other such place:

Can you preview it
are there fluids in it
battery or no battery in the set
does it turn over
is it cannibalized
is the control box intact
does the hour meter look like it was replaced, screws fresh or rusty, paint chipped, new looking meter on a scrap heap etc...
Is it low hour, see above.



Hopefully this is in the theme of the thread

:hammer:and no:shock:

Now I see this thread is what you should do after you get our new genset home Doh!!

Hopefully you:

read the above and other threads and didn't endup with a piece of junik!

get a TM and read the directions on how tho start it up and adjust it.

I'm going to sit back and observe and read other genset threads!
 
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