Looking into getting a Mutt

I got to sit behind the wheel of a Mutt today, and hey - I fit! I'm 6'7" and have been looking for a MV that will fit in my garage and that I'll fit in. While I'd love a Deuce or 5-ton, those will have to wait for a while, so I was thrilled to find the M151.

So, advice?!?! I'd love something that I can drive somewhat regularly (occasional to work, to run errands, etc), and have fun with off road. I would like to work on the Mutt and restore it, but not have it be something I'd be afraid to drive. I also would like to find something somewhat local, as transporting a MV could end up being cost prohibitive.

What should I expect to pay for a Mutt in the shape I describe? What should I look for (besides cut vs uncut)? Any help would be appreciated!

You know moose I was just about to ask the same things although I'm one up on you I have found one near me and in pretty good shape. I was about to start a thread on it when I found this one. So if you don't mind my highjacking it a bit I have the same questions only I have pics of what I'm looking at. I'm not sure if it's for sale or anything yet as I wasn't able to talk to the owner. I plan to go back tomorrow and do that, I'd really like to know how hard power steering would be to add on since I would be letting my wife drive it in parades and such. How hard is it to find parts for it as apposed to the M715 which is getting harder and harder to find replacements for certain things. I'd also like to know what a good price to offer would be on this one in the shape it's in I was thinking around $500-$800 but wasn't sure. Also if someone sees anything major missing I'd like to know. Thanks everyone!!!!

Thread-jacking is fine by me as long as it furthers the initial cause, as your questions does. Thread-jacking that takes things off-topic get annoying. Good luck with your find... I'd love to find something like that around here, and know what to pay for it!

My friend Allan just bought one that was uncut. He has spend about a month or two fixing it up. Most parts are out there and not very expensive. You have to be careful since they have a reputation for rolling over easily. And, newer ethanol gas is hard on the rubber parts of the fuel pump.

I know of two of them in Lancaster, Ohio. The guy whats $10,000 each. There right off of US33 East on the right if you going east. They both come with ammo trailers, but the need some work.

Yeah there is no way I'd pay that much unless it was a trailer queen/parade ready machine and that's not what I want.....

Hello
I've owned three of them 1) '67 M151A1 & 2) 70's M151A2s. I'd like to reccomend this site for all things G838 www.g838.org many of the guys who post over there are members here so there's a lot of cross board(er) action. The mutt in the above images is a fairly complete M151A1 with an early (screw adjust) front seat frame. I'd put it's value if running (with title) at around 3k (maybe).

The all important thing to consider when looking at M151s is the body tub. Everything else can be had or replaced. The G838 series of jeeps used a unitized body tub so there is no separate frame like on earlier jeeps. Rust is a real issue with these trucks so be prepared to crawl underneith and inspect a potential purchase.

Arguably the next important thing to look for is a good (clear) title. Remember these 1/4 tons were never officially surplused out so a title is important. There are ways of obtaining a title so if you find a mutt that has a really good body or meets your criteria, then don't let the lack of a title completely turn you off, but take that into consideration

Parts availability is pretty good right now but some things are starting to become difficult to obtain. Reason for ease of parts availability? Lack of available vehicles to put them on.

10k will get you an uncut, titled, running M151 that needs very little. Trailer queens & show winners are bringing in the mid teens to mid twenties.

Rollovers can happen and I've never met a Vet who served when the M151 was in service that doesn't have a roll over story. Remember that most of those roll overs were due to driver error and that if you use the vehicle with common sence, you'll be fine. The A2 version with it's trailing arm rear suspention & proper driver training corrected a lot of the roll over issues.

If I think of something else, I'll post later.

Matt

L1A1 said:

10k will get you an uncut, titled, running M151 that needs very little. Trailer queens & show winners are bringing in the mid teens to mid twenties.

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That's not what I wanted to hear. I've crept up in what I'm willing to pay for my first MV from ~ $2000 to maybe near $4000, but no way I'm willing (or able) to go $10,000. I just don't know what to do...

I don't know how hard it would be to retrofit power steering on a MUTT or if it's even possible, but why would you want to? They were pretty easy to turn right out of the box with the standard steering. The M151 family did have some roll over issues, and I have a personal memory of this from my time in the Army, but if you drive it with respect and use good judgement, you won't have a problem. Just my .02

moose97 said:

That's not what I wanted to hear. I've crept up in what I'm willing to pay for my first MV from ~ $2000 to maybe near $4000, but no way I'm willing (or able) to go $10,000. I just don't know what to do...

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My first mutt was a 1967 M151A1 that was unrestored, rewelded & titled. It set me back about 3k and was a good runner. I did a complete tear down resto on that A1 and wound getting 11k for it. Still have a photo of it hanging on the wall next to my computer.

My first A2 set me back 8k. It was titled, uncut and while it wouldn't win at concourse, it was an excl. runner (I still miss her). Funny, I just noticed that I have a pic of it, hanging right next to my A1.

My current A2 is also titled & uncut and set me back less then the first A2 (think I paid around 5k for it) it has some mechanical issues-but nothing I couldn't fix myself. Sadly, I don't have a pic of it to hang with the other two (better get to work on that).

Moose, you can get into an M151 for not a whole lot of money , you just have to weigh the variables of what you want times what you can afford. The first two mutts I described, I had a lot of fun with. Remember the rougher they are the cheaper to buy they usually are (this isn't always the case). How mechanically inclined are you? buying a fixer-upper may be the way to go.
Matt

Like I said in my first post, I would want something I could have fun with. Not sure that I want to do a full restoration - but I am willing to work on what I acquire. I've got a former Marine buddy who is able to help me work on what ever I get. I should have taken a picture of the Mutt the guy here had - that's almost exactly what I would want. He has done complete frame-off restorations on his other Jeep's, but left his Mutt as a "beater" to be driven off-road. I didn't ask him how much he spent on it...

So, Matt - would I be able, you think, to get something not roached in my price range? Closer to $2000 than $4000?

I bought mine 15 years ago from someone who had no idea about what it was. I paid $400.00 for it and is is rewelded. The tranmission was in a bucket and no fuel tank. It was badly rusted underneath but not so bad on top. I got a transmission for $100.00 and a tank for $50.00, and got it running. Then I stood it on end and welded flat bar to all the rusted channels underneath. It was not long that I had to put a cylinder head on it which cost $100.00. I drove it for several years and one cylinder started oil fouling the plug which was OK because I had 3 brand new engines in the shop that I got off e-bay. Stuck one in last year and she runs like a champ now. Oh, the engines cost me $203.00 apiece and the guy brought them to me

I guess all this is to say it can be done cheap but not fast. If you want fast it probably will not be cheap.

moose97 said:

So, Matt - would I be able, you think, to get something not roached in my price range? Closer to $2000 than $4000?

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Moose
When you sya (well, wrote) the above, I'm reminded of my first mutt as I paid $3400 for it . It was a reweld but looked good and ran well. So, yes I think you can get into one that is a runner (most likely a reweld) within the price range you describe. You just have to be patient is what I've learned. After I sold my first A2, I thought I'll never find another one like that and low & behold, I did. So they're out there.

Like I posted earlier, the tub is the most important part of the truck. Everything else can be brought or replaced. With a reweld, you definately want to check out how it was done. There's more ways to do that wrong then right. My personal recommendation is to stay away from the 1/4 cut rewelds. These jeeps were only sheetmetal afterall. 1/2 cut repaired properly is OK. Never cut is best
Matt

I still haven't had luck catching the owner of the jeep I'm looking at however I did talk to the owner of the used car lot across the street and the owner of the jeep is semi retired and won't work in the heat. I've been trying to catch him after lunch so either late in the afternoon or early in the morning it is. I was able however to take a closer look under it at the frame and it has been cut and it has been rewelded and not very well. Also took a look in the battery box and its rusted out and it's even rusted into the frame some. The passenger side floor pan need some work as well however the rest of the body looked good surface rust only . The frame really bothered me how hard/safe is it to weld on the frame again and how much is to much when it comes to over kill?

M715VFD405 said:

I was able however to take a closer look under it at the frame and it has been cut and it has been rewelded and not very well. Also took a look in the battery box and its rusted out and it's even rusted into the frame some. The passenger side floor pan need some work as well however the rest of the body looked good surface rust only . The frame really bothered me how hard/safe is it to weld on the frame again and how much is to much when it comes to over kill?

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Chris
With that nugget of info, I'd readjust my estimate of it's value to around $1200.00 or so (probably less). If you get the chance to look under that A1 again, check the front cross member just aft of the engine compartment. That's a pretty important area as well.

The "frame" which there really isn't one isn't made out of special steel like a commercial road tractor's so it can be welded on, no problem. for starters, you'll want a "large underbody repair kit" Frontline Military Vehicles used to sell them. I may have one of the rear most cross members (where the tow hitch bolts to) from one of those kits that I won't be needing.

Reapir of the main spars (that's what I call those two large frame rails under the M151) I don't feel comfortable giving advice on how to do this as I paid a profesional fabricator to repair mine. From what I'm to understand what they did was to separate the two halves and insert a slightly smaller "boxed section" inside the main spar. This smaller spar was maybe 2 or 3 feet long and was used to give the main spar regidity Both larger sections were butted together with the smaller boxed section inside & everything was welded. a steel "strap" the width of the bottom of the main spar was then welded to the length of the main spar from just rear of the upturn for the front suspension to just forward of the rear suspension. There may have also been "large patch panels" applied over the (side) areas where the two frame halves were butted together but I can't remember-it's been a while. Hope that wasn't too confusing.

Jeep panels plus & Fla tactical were the only guys making replacement panels for the M151 and I'm not sure if jeep panels plus is still around. My experience with Fla tactical wasn't bad but I know one of the members over on G838 had a pretty bad experience with them.

Matt

Thanks Matt that sounds like solid info. I don't know how much this guy would want for the jeep but if I can get it cheap enough I think I'll get it if he's reasonable.

You're welcome, Chris. That sounds like a solid plan but don't be discouraged if the owner acts like that A1 was Gen.Westmoreland's Personal command jeep. It happens. If this one doesn't work out, there will be others. Of that, I'm sure.

Matt

I have a feeling that the guy might be reasonable but I still haven't been able to get a hold of him, from what I understand he's the best mechanic in town but is old and his son was in an accident and has some sort of brain damage so he doesn't work if he can help it in the heat. It's been over 110 here for a few weeks now and I can't say as I blame him. But if for some reason he does think it's made of gold I'm not worried I'm sure I can find something else to get my OD fix with lol.

Well I finally caught the guy at work, and he doesn't own the jeep and he's sent guys to him before without any luck..... However I might have a way to pull some strings to get a hold of the guy and get him to sell. The jeep has been there for years and the shop owner seemed to be tired of having it rot away on his property. Time will tell but I have a good feeling about all this. Wish me luck

If you ever want to drive a deuce, something that will help is moving the peddles down about 2-3 inches in the bracket. My '72 had detents in the rod below the peddle where you could adjust them, my '87 didn't, but we made some and it is night and day better.

I am only 6'3" but to use the unadjusted peddles, I had to ram my knee between the steering wheel and door just to get on top of the clutch. Now I can do it without any drama.

Now I still have to look around the windshield wiper cylinder which is directly in my view, but I manage.

These trucks were designed for really small people. Without modifications, it really is a bit tight.