Deuce Still wandering across the lane

So I return to this excellent site, and all the good people on it, to ask a question. Before I do ask that question, let me first state that I know there are several forum posts on this topic, and I have poured over them several times( decided to start a new one to keep it clear on where I have been and seen). So let me tell you what I have done.

RancherRob (member on this site) owns an M35A2, and he hired me to work on it with him (I am a 10 year Army Mechanic Vet, and have worked on the M35A2 before). We replaced the stock tires with the 395 HEMMT tires, rebuild the suspension, powder coated all components to the suspension, added inter-lockers to the diff's and a few other minor modifications. We road tested the vehicle about a week or so ago and found her wandering all over the road. We both referred back to this site and got all sorts of good advice. Looked into the steering gear box and found that it was out of spec, rebuilt it and tightened it up. When we assembled the 395's, I inflated them to 60 psi, then after receiving advice to do so, lowered the tire pressure to 40 psi. Also measured the toe in and found the tires toe out .25 inch, so adjusted that to 0, as it was also advised that it should be as close to 0 as possible. I test drove the truck last week and found that she still wanders a bit (far better than before), but rancherrob would like to eliminate as much of it as possible. Other than tearing the front suspension apart and flipping/ grinding the shims on the leaf springs, is there anything more that can be done?

As always, thank you in advance for the info, ideas..

Volfe

I don't have an answer for you but lets move this to the Deuce section and you might get better help. I also changed the title for a little easier search.

Is the truck stock except the wheels?

Besides the wheels, and the inter-lockers, yes the truck is stock. Thanks for the Help..

I would set the toe in to 1/8 to a 1/4.

Every vehicle I have re-aligned the front tires.........I have had to toe them in a little to stop the wandering.

1) The more the toe in the better it will stay true........the worse for tire wear.

2) The closer to "0" the truck will wander........but tire scrub is almost nothing.

You have to find a happy middle ground.........not much scrubbing of the tread but still enough to keep a steady line. Like said above start off with 1/4" toe in and see how you like it, with the larger tires you might have to go more to get what feeling you are happy with........just remember rule number one.

It's a 40 year old truck you can't expect it not to wonder a little bit

Also I found with mine (XML's) The tire was happy with between 45-47 pounds of air.........not too stiff but stiff enough not to get too much "wash" and sway out of them.

seano11 said:

It's a 40 year old truck you can't expect it not to wonder a little bit

Click to expand...

40 year old or 60 year old..........if the front has been rebuilt and the gear box rebuilt and everything nice and tight the thing should rail down the road just like any other vehicle...........I have been in a car only 3 years old and it wandered all over the place............with the right amount of toe the thing will drive true!!!

all the things you did were good - but i didn't see any mention of modifying the spring perch (caster adjustment)

some say you can flip them others (gringletaub) show a simple modification to grind out some material from inside the thicker side of the wedge to correct the caster for radial tires.

that should fix it for you.

I was wondering about being able to adjust caster on these trucks just never looked into what all was needed..........would improve the ride considerably if you could get that dialed in better.

Like you say for the larger radial tires.

The gringeltaube shim fix is really the only thing that will fix the problem and really isn't that hard to do #110 (permalink) . Wither it be G177 tires or larger wheels it is the fix for the wandering Duce #25 (permalink) http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce-modification-hot-rodding/83547-problems-goodyear-g-177-tires.html ,

Seem that flipping the plates works if you have power steering otherwise use this method:

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/attach...-truck-wanders-spring-seat-stock-vs.-mod..jpg

Lol... for reference you can ask member Sandcobra164, what he did to his, to cure the problem...


G.

Just flipped the spring perches on the front axle of mine and it fixed my wander. Just have to drill a new locator hole in the other side. It stopped my tire scrubbing also! I have the 395's on stock rims.

G,
He doesn't have to ask, I'll post up willingly. Following your instructions in the above referenced posts, I removed the spring perches and ground done the leading edge on a bench grinder. I tried to stay as close to Gringletaubes' drawings as I could. End result, re-installed and now the truck drive's straight down the road and I drive it MUCH more now.

Thanks Sandcobra.
I know that this way - adding just 2-3 degrees, to end up with a caster of +/- (+)4 - may be a bit on the conservative side, but at least it will NOT alter the stock driveshaft angularity too much.
Now, if this relatively simple mod. does the trick... then someone please explain why flipping around the wedges, would be any better??? Besides having to drill new holes in them.... the new caster angle will then be over (+)10º !!! (drawing, below...) And even if it drives nice; what about the resulting U-joint angle, DS to fnt.axle pinion?? And what about limiting even further the (factory)ability to steer full right when articulated....???


BTW, the 1st pic below shows the left side spring seat from an M35A3 ... (it was my first time ever crawling under an A3, at the GA Rally!) ... besides being approx. 1" taller, its inclination is evidently less than the A2's! Note that the surfaces between lower spring leaf and top of axle tube appear to be almost parallel.
Just for comparison, 2nd pic shows my truck's RH front spring, after modifications...


G.

I had this problem when I went to T831 radials and fixed it by changing the caster angle. I just cut some mild steel shims and stuck them under the stock shims and it worked. Steering is still a little lighter than I would like, but I can keep it on the road at 55 at least. Still gets scary in ruts though.

I saw it had made a big differance in the inclination of the axle but didn't know it went to 10*! It just came down to it was easier to drill new holes. Then I could just swap it back if it wasn't right. I didn't have something that I could remove that much material easily with. After removal it took less than 10 min to pull out the drill press and drill 2 holes.

What did ya'll use to remove that material evenly?

...what about an angle grinder; maybe a short piece of (rusty)flat stock (to better mark/detect the "high" spots); eventually even a caliper to measure before and after.......?

Nothing that would require high-precision machining, really....


G.

based on the thread form back in ~2009? wiht M35Tom; I get the impression that not all the spring perches are the same as his shim flip resulted in only +4* caster (measured with a magnetic guage)