Tailgate lift assist using spring hinges... with photos!

TwistedOaks · Jul 3, 2016

As much as I love the feel of a good workout, and don't mind herniating myself on the regular, I started looking for ways to help ease the pain of lifting the tailgate. It was actually a combo of that, and forgetting to latch and having the thing slam down in traffic (when you look back and think hmmm... did i just back over a Honda?).

The Deuce forum had some great ideas about 4 years ago, none of which seemed to materialize. There's talk of cables and garage door springs... But the price of the ramp hinge is almost negligible. So, two 5/8" rods, two 3/4" spring hinges (LH and RH), and a little light metal cutting/grinding...

I was thinking of welding the top bar of the spring... But I like the removability. I've ZERO welding experience. But I'm thinking of starting. I'm working with a lot of metal lately, and there's a hundred different projects that I say to myself, "I wish I could get someone over here to do a weld"... That's a different topic though.

https://youtu.be/QtqLy-DXiDs

74M35A2 · Jul 3, 2016

Genius! How far down will they let the gate free hang open? I know this is not a welding thread, but I have always said people are only limited by their tools. I'd strongly suggest you to buy a used name brand MIG welder (vs new Harbor Freight welder). It is just like a hot glue gun for metal, just pull the trigger and go. You'll get better with usage. I'd say within 2 hours of using and experimenting with it, you would be able to lay welds that are photo worthy. The rest of your pic has very good attention to detail in all of its surroundings, you would be fabulous with a welder. Start checking CraigsList in your area for a used Miller, Lincoln, or Hobart, and keep being creative. These trucks should have come with your mod.

TCD · Jul 3, 2016

Howdy,

This is a GREAT idea!

I'm 5'8", creaky and cranky and more so every time I have to manipulate the tailgate. This will really save me a lot of pain and suffering ;-)

I am also planning on building a set of stops for the tailgate as I want it to go no further than level with the bed so this is also a real improvement to my design!

Now if I just need to solve the problem of building stowable ramps into the cab and bed for my old Golden; at 85 lbs. it's a big dead-lift for me to get him up up up and in...

I'm thinking of using PSP to build a ramp or two and this idea may also morph into that design also.

Thanks again!

tom n tyler

gimpyrobb · Jul 3, 2016

I agree with the above, but feel stick is better to start with.

DON'T BUY 110, ONLY A 220 MACHINE!

marchplumber · Jul 3, 2016

gimpyrobb said:
I agree with the above, but feel stick is better to start with.

DON'T BUY 110, ONLY A 220 MACHINE!

I have both. I like my 220 better, but one ten comes in handy every now and then, especially it's portability. Practice makes perfect, and I need a LOT more practice! LOL But I can stick two pieces of metal together! LOL NICE mod. How far will it hang? Completely vertical? Sometimes for loading, I have to get as close to bed as possible as I don't have a "drop-side" bed for the truck.

74M35A2 · Jul 3, 2016

gimpyrobb said:
I agree with the above, but feel stick is better to start with.

DON'T BUY 110, ONLY A 220 MACHINE!

Stick welding is harder to learn than MIG. Stick is what farmers use to repair their rusty brush hogs. Now post some pics of the tailgate fully down!

davo727 · Jul 3, 2016

Stick is what is used to perform critical pipeline welds also.

74M35A2 said:
Stick welding is harder to learn than MIG. Stick is what farmers use to repair their rusty brush hogs. Now post some pics of the tailgate fully down!

TwistedOaks · Jul 3, 2016

Thanks for the advice guys! I'm already looking on CL now. Take a look at the video link (now above). Fully down is more like 90%, but can fully compress to flat with very little extra effort.

74M35A2 said:
Stick welding is harder to learn than MIG. Stick is what farmers use to repair their rusty brush hogs. Now post some pics of the tailgate fully down!

Jbulach · Jul 3, 2016

Not sure what your welding, but you do not want to weld on the springs. Spring steel does not take well to welding, no matter what type of machine you have, nor do rusty bush hogs, or anything rusty as far as that goes...

M925A2 with dump hoist

TwistedOaks · Jul 3, 2016

Yeah, it was a reflex action... wanting to get the spring ends not to stick out. I changed my mind on it (now for a second reason), because it's one cotter pin and I can remove the whole assembly, which makes for versatility/serviceability.

Jbulach said:
Not sure what your welding, but you do not want to weld on the springs. Spring steel does not take well to welding, no matter what type of machine you have, nor do rusty bush hogs, or anything rusty as far as that goes...

M925A2 with dump hoist

Spyderman · Jul 3, 2016

WOW great idea you had there. :beer:

74M35A2 · Jul 3, 2016

I'm going to he greedy, but can I ask for a quick pic or vid of how it reacts with one spring in it vs 2? I'm looking for a little less assist, but that much on a drop side with troop seat installed may be just the ticket.

jbayer · Jul 4, 2016

Great Idea. And thanks for having the fore thought to post the link for the springs.

tobyS · Jul 4, 2016

Good idea with the torsion spring. It appears a bit stiff. I used to be a sales manager for a spring company and still have some contacts. If there is interest, I'll check with them to make with a slightly smaller wire size and more turns, so it will go down all the way and not take a permanent set, I could check out their price (and will buy for myself of course).

As far as welding, splurge and get the Lincoln Welding manual that will teach you any kind of welding you want to do. I worked in engineering at a boiler manufacturer in late 70's so had to know code welding...and this book still taught me a lot.

I recommend starting with stick for several reasons. First, you learn what the pool of weld is doing...it's a liquid and liquids behave differently when flat, vertical or overhead. By far the hardest is overhead, since that weld pool wants to fall back on you. Second, you learn how to penetrate, not just put weld on the surface that may or may not penetrate, which a lot of people that learn on a mig do. Some people call that "slobbering" a weld on and most don't hold.

There is one drawback to welding with a stick....thin metal. When the rod is thicker than the metal it is very easy to burn right through. Practice, practice, practice before you make a critical weld or one that has to be just right. A good weld will have as much or more cross section as the base metal.

If your welding only sheet metal, then go ahead and go with mig and a small wire. They can weld in very low ranges. Sticks in 1/16 are available but 3/32" is more common. Most structural and general purpose use 1/8".

Use 6011 rod first and DC. Switch over to AC and see the difference. 6011 is 60,000 psi tensile strength and a general purpose, all position rod. The weld "pool" will solidify even overhead if you let it. For higher strength, the 7018 is 70,000 psi but it shrinks a lot and will pull or distort what you are welding. It's much harder overhead as well. I use 7018 over a 6011 for a really strong weld (like log bunks or sawmill equipment that takes a beating all day). Then there are 90 series and hardfacing rods when you need a wear surface...not so much with mig.

I agree with Gimpy for most welding, use 240volt. But with thin sheet metal you can go with the newer 110 volt MIG, they have much improved electronics.

Edit; .362" is extremely large spring wire. My guess is .200 to .250" is plenty and with about double the number of turns. If there is interest, I'll have them put numbers into the engineering formula's for the weight, start position and end position to come up with one that is "just right".

TwistedOaks · Jul 4, 2016

tobyS said:
Good idea with the torsion spring. It appears a bit stiff. I used to be a sales manager for a spring company and still have some contacts. If there is interest, I'll check with them to make with a slightly smaller wire size and more turns, so it will go down all the way and not take a permanent set, I could check out their price (and will buy for myself of course).

As far as welding, splurge and get the Lincoln Welding manual that will teach you any kind of welding you want to do. I worked in engineering at a boiler manufacturer in late 70's so had to know code welding...and this book still taught me a lot.

I recommend starting with stick for several reasons. First, you learn what the pool of weld is doing...it's a liquid and liquids behave differently when flat, vertical or overhead. By far the hardest is overhead, since that weld pool wants to fall back on you. Second, you learn how to penetrate, not just put weld on the surface that may or may not penetrate, which a lot of people that learn on a mig do. Some people call that "slobbering" a weld on and most don't hold.

There is one drawback to welding with a stick....thin metal. When the rod is thicker than the metal it is very easy to burn right through. Practice, practice, practice before you make a critical weld or one that has to be just right. A good weld will have as much or more cross section as the base metal.

If your welding only sheet metal, then go ahead and go with mig and a small wire. They can weld in very low ranges. Sticks in 1/16 are available but 3/32" is more common. Most structural and general purpose use 1/8".

Use 6011 rod first and DC. Switch over to AC and see the difference. 6011 is 60,000 psi tensile strength and a general purpose, all position rod. The weld "pool" will solidify even overhead if you let it. For higher strength, the 7018 is 70,000 psi but it shrinks a lot and will pull or distort what you are welding. It's much harder overhead as well. I use 7018 over a 6011 for a really strong weld (like log bunks or sawmill equipment that takes a beating all day). Then there are 90 series and hardfacing rods when you need a wear surface...not so much with mig.

I agree with Gimpy for most welding, use 240volt. But with thin sheet metal you can go with the newer 110 volt MIG, they have much improved electronics.

Edit; .362" is extremely large spring wire. My guess is .200 to .250" is plenty and with about double the number of turns. If there is interest, I'll have them put numbers into the engineering formula's for the weight, start position and end position to come up with one that is "just right".

I'm interested, just because I'm going to put them on the side panels next. what I liked about these in particular was they're common enough to get more.

tobyS · Jul 4, 2016

Then lets get some sizes and weights...or at least a wish list. Mine is for an M35 rear gate. My sides are fixed. I'm sure there are plenty of 939 series rear gates too. There are full and double sides.

It seems there should be a certain preload, before the gate goes down to hold it in place when closed. Like at the start of going down it takes 5 lbs of pull or some such number and at 90* it supports the weight fully.

I don't have a scale to make the measurement of the weight (at horizontal) but could estimate. Can you measure coil OD...it appears to fit nicely? I can see having a latch to hold it down in the 180* position for loading, using the step.

As far as "getting more"...this is a really basic torsion spring, so reproduction should not be too hard. Maybe one or more of the parts vendors will want to join in on this.

Csm Davis · Jul 4, 2016

TwistedOaks said:
As much as I love the feel of a good workout, and don't mind herniating myself on the regular, I started looking for ways to help ease the pain of lifting the tailgate. It was actually a combo of that, and forgetting to latch and having the thing slam down in traffic (when you look back and think hmmm... did i just back over a Honda?).

The Deuce forum had some great ideas about 4 years ago, none of which seemed to materialize. There's talk of cables and garage door springs... But the price of the ramp hinge is almost negligible. So, two 5/8" rods, two 3/4" spring hinges (LH and RH), and a little light metal cutting/grinding...
View attachment 631391 View attachment 631390 View attachment 631389

I was thinking of welding the top bar of the spring... But I like the removability. I've ZERO welding experience. But I'm thinking of starting. I'm working with a lot of metal lately, and there's a hundred different projects that I say to myself, "I wish I could get someone over here to do a weld"... That's a different topic though.

View attachment 631395 View attachment 631394 View attachment 631393 View attachment 631392

https://youtu.be/QtqLy-DXiDs

If you want to you could weld a tube over the ends and the springs wouldn't stick out, and you could still disassemble it, and it would reinforce the sheet metal.

sent from my decrepit fingers

juanprado · Jul 4, 2016

I am thinking slip a vacuum or fuel hose over the 2 nubs.

This is a great idea. I am height challenged and can tell you I do not find it fun to raise the tailgate now that I run 395's at least for me it is a chore.

Outstanding innovation!

Jbulach · Jul 4, 2016

Maybe use a loom clamp, if you don't mind putting a small bolt through your gate?

TwistedOaks · Jul 4, 2016

This is why I love this place... The innovation is amazing. I like all three ideas for the ends. I think a welded tube would be my choice. Though for the average non-welder the loom would be good if you don't mind a nut on the inside tailgate. I might go with rubber at the moment, just because it's readily available and would probably give a nice spongy feel.

I'll say this, as I dropped the side gates this morning (attempting to prep the bed for a re-finish before heading out for 4th festivities at our local former-military chow-hall Frankie's Patriot BBQ), I realized that without "soldier-B", I'm not going to be dead lifting those gates (with troop seats) for much longer without needing regular medical attention. When I got them back up, then lifted my spring-loaded tailgate... Wow. I felt like superman.

It's really a matter of getting it past that inertial mass point, which this does perfectly.

Also, the springs held up REALLY well yesterday after being under load most of the day. Loaded my S250 shelter into the rear end, and winched it into a tree stand (tree house for the kiddo). Had the vast majority of the weight sitting on the tailgate for the better part of the day (chained at 90 degrees) which meant the springs stayed partially compressed all day. They returned to neutral position without any change.

Tailgate lift assist using spring hinges... with photos!

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