No Driving Off Base-New Recovery Rules?

Chief_919 said:

FYI, as of SEP 1 2011 no more base stickers. ID card check only for those with one, subject to random insurance/registration checks, those without produce DL, insurance and registration.

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Depends on the base for the sticker and whether those without ID card can get on without being sponsored (I just had to sign one on today).

Chief_919 said:

That said, the rules and law remain the same. To operate a vehicle on post, valid registration and insurance is required. Why some here feel they should be above the rules is beyond me.

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100% true.

Chief_919 said:

FYI, as of SEP 1 2011 no more base stickers. ID card check only for those with one, subject to random insurance/registration checks, those without produce DL, insurance and registration.

That said, the rules and law remain the same. To operate a vehicle on post, valid registration and insurance is required. Why some here feel they should be above the rules is beyond me.

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Not here in Southwest Region. Just updated all of my vehicles today out to 2015. They debated that here for awhile and decided to keep it status quo.

bearboley said:

I am gonna chime in on the $500 min. I've been involved with moving and rigging for a while and 500 is not that much really. You have to consider what it takes to do the job, the biggest is the insurance you have to carry it is very expensive, next is the equipment do you know how long it takes to turn a profit with equipment that cost a half million dollars and 500 dollars a pop? Then you got the overhead everyday cost like fuel and labor, maintenance. I was never in business to work for free, I bet none would go to work very long without a pay check. i don't know how many times I've been at a industrial auction loading out and a fellow will walk over and want a small mill or lathe loaded and you tell him $100 and they fly off the handle and call you a theif, but they come back they always come back. So i would say if you went and satisfied the requirements you too could become a approved rigger also then I bet you would think that 500 bucks was a lot cheaper then.

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Very well said! I am a MV owner and also the owner of an auto repair shop with both med and light duty wreckers. I pay a lot of money to insurance, the state of Virgina, fuel pumps, and employees that has to be recovered. I have towed off Fort Meade and paid a driver to sit in the truck entrance line for an hour to take out a $300 tow.

What does an "approved tow company" mean...at Meade? it means you can prove that you are insured and approved by BARTO (board of towing and recovery) if for hire. I see people towing m1009's and 8's out on trailers with no problem all the time with no flack behind personal "not for hire trucks".

This is nothing more than Uncle Sam protecting you from yourself....not to mention my family and the families of our soldiers you may encounter prior to leaving base in your new 5 ton truck listed as " gas pedal sticks and no brakes" toy.

In coming late to this thread I would also point out that the states, territories, commonwealths and districts that make up this country all have different vehicle and traffic laws. Every military installation has it's own policies in addition to DOD ones, those of the various armed services and, for the Coast Guard, the Dept of Homeland Defense.

In all of the services intermediate commanders and local installation commanders can make policies that are more protective or more restrictive than the ones set by their service or higher level chain of command. If the First Army's area has 50 installation you could have 50 different sets of rules. After all the post commander is just that, the commander. Your ball is on their playground so they make the rules. They command and everyone else complies.

Making statements and giving/taking advice based on your experiences at another installation, in another state or on another date is a waste of time. You need to know and deal with "ground truth" as of the day you bid and the day you pick up your purchase.

On some military installations the military law enforcement folks have dual jurisdiction in dealing with civilians and you'll respond to a local court if charged. On some they have the power of detention and will detain you until a local LEO comes and cites you and you'll still go to a local court. On some, such as the place doghead and I usually deal with (Fort Drum) the MPs generally detain you until the federal police come and charge you if it is a violation of post regs or federal law in question and you will be at the mercy of a federal magistrate. Those folks don't take prisoners or play around. Then they'll refer you to a local LEO for vehicle and traffic law violations or criminal charges applicable to state law. At least that was Fort Drum's policy when I retired in 2005.

You are subject to prosecution in both the federal and local jurisdiction for many offenses.

Just learn the rules at the location where the vehicle is and in the states you will move the vehicle through and comply with them. You are free to complain all you want but it's not a democracy and you don't get a vote. In entering any installation you agree to play by their rules, submit to searches of your person and possessions etc. If you aren't prepared to follow the rules then don't bid and don't go on their playground.

Lance

I treat it like you are a guest on their base

I go on three bases locally and each one has there own security protocol, one base has a different protocol at each gate.

greenjeepster said:

I just got an official letter from GL: It states

"Starting Feb 1st 2012. Due to Costumer concern, We will now allow a 12 month window for loadouts. All sales are going to be conducted from one central location in Guam. Access for preview and loadout is by boat only, no civilian personnel will be allowed to enter through any of the gates. Paddles will be provided with purchases of triwalls and any other object that floats. (see new loadout assistance policy on our website) No other loadout assistance will be provided. We thank you for being a loyal customer and will now be sending you a Christmas card every year.
Sincerely GL staff opcorn:

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HAHA that's good, you had me at the beginning sentence. I thought GL came to their senses on the loadout window.

greenjeepster said:

In KY I drove two off of Boone without registrations, both had insurance though. KY does not issue transit plates and will not register a vehicle without a title under any circumstances. That was only about a 10 mile trip and both trucks had been fully serviced and gone over by me in the three months I had waiting for EUC. That was during the Great Glowing Gauge Siege of 2009.

If you live in a state that will issue a transit plate then getting one is no problem, but for states that don't, and with GL not issuing SF-97 until after pickup, registration is impossible.

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Personally I think GL may have to rethink their own policies. Don't get me wrong I am all for safe driving and etc, but if you buy a truck from GL they should amend their policies to read if you intend to drive purchased vehicles off the lot you need to be in compliance with all safe driving laws including ins, proper licensing, and plates. To accomplish all this (which is not impossible) GL should allow for the SF-97 forms to be applied for as soon as the auction ends which will enable us to get the plates while we are waiting for the EUC, not waitn until the truck leaves the yard. Same goes for insurance. you need to show proper title and ownership in order to get insurance. What this will do is put the responsibility for safe driving on the shoulders of the buyers. and at the same time give them the option of a "recovery" in the true sense of the word.
In the perspective of GL it is just easier to require a tow truck or lowboy...... but some of us are still old school ............gonna be hard to change that.

grunex125 said:

Personally I think GL may have to rethink their own policies. Don't get me wrong I am all for safe driving and etc, but if you buy a truck from GL they should amend their policies to read if you intend to drive purchased vehicles off the lot you need to be in compliance with all safe driving laws including ins, proper licensing, and plates. To accomplish all this (which is not impossible) GL should allow for the SF-97 forms to be applied for as soon as the auction ends which will enable us to get the plates while we are waiting for the EUC, not waitn until the truck leaves the yard. Same goes for insurance. you need to show proper title and ownership in order to get insurance. What this will do is put the responsibility for safe driving on the shoulders of the buyers. and at the same time give them the option of a "recovery" in the true sense of the word.
In the perspective of GL it is just easier to require a tow truck or lowboy...... but some of us are still old school ............gonna be hard to change that.

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It's NOT a GL policy. They have ZERO authority over driving on base. Those rules are set by area commanders. Sometimes the base commander sometimes the region commander. If a set of restrictions are applied to a base or bases, it was NOT done by GL.

Those rules might be in place BECAUSE of something that happened at GL, but GL ain't making the rules.

DUG said:

It's NOT a GL policy. They have ZERO authority over driving on base. Those rules are set by area commanders. Sometimes the base commander sometimes the region commander. If a set of restrictions are applied to a base or bases, it was NOT done by GL.

Those rules might be in place BECAUSE of something that happened at GL, but GL ain't making the rules.

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In addition, GL isn't going to start changing the SF-97 procedure so you can get tags. They require you to pick it up first so you can verify the VIN. If they allow SF-97 to be applied for before pickup, then it goes off what the GL employee puts, and if it is in error (as it quite often is) GL is liable for the correction. So by requiring it to be picked up first, all liability for any incorrect VIN on the SF-97 is on you. GL is not about to start taking responsibility for verifying your VIN just so you acn save a tow bill.

Listen Mr. if you don't want to follow the rules or don't agree with them then don't buy from gl.......There's always craigslist or ebay then u can drive with no registration!!!! Your a guest on a military base follow the rules and don't complain before you screw it up for all of us...

ryan77 said:

Listen Mr. if you don't want to follow the rules or don't agree with them then don't buy from gl.......There's always craigslist or ebay then u can drive with no registration!!!! Your a guest on a military base follow the rules and don't complain before you screw it up for all of us...

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Hey!!.......come on don't get crabby with me...... If you guys had read my post you would have seen that I do not in any way advocate driving these trucks illegally. bottom line is that because of the way things work out a lot of people will/have take that chance. what I am pointing out is that because of the way it works either GL or the military or whoever sets the rules for the SF-97 or base rules may have inadvertantly contributed to these activities in the past. I think......yes it is a good thing to have them trucked off base, Anyone here or wherever that has driven a truck off base has done so illegally. Further more I do not condem GL or the military for the rules.
In respect to the prior post to yours, Now that it was put that way about the mix up potential for the vin numbers or lot numbers, good point, I'd have to agree with that.......

Just back off on me, I'm merely suggesting some possible ways that the process may have been changed to accomodate the End User, or stream line the process to allow for legal on highway travel within the laws of each state. And believe me there are ways. Anyone who disagrees should read their states laws on transport of purchased vehicles. I do believe there are in most states provisions that allow for driving of these vehicles or any vehicle from site of purchase (auctions come to mind here) to a garage of your choice to be updated and worked on to pass DOT inspections.

grunex125 said:

Hey!!.......come on don't get crabby with me...... If you guys had read my post you would have seen that I do not in any way advocate driving these trucks illegally. bottom line is that because of the way things work out a lot of people will/have take that chance. what I am pointing out is that because of the way it works either GL or the military or whoever sets the rules for the SF-97 or base rules may have inadvertantly contributed to these activities in the past. I think......yes it is a good thing to have them trucked off base, Anyone here or wherever that has driven a truck off base has done so illegally. Further more I do not condem GL or the military for the rules.
In respect to the prior post to yours, Now that it was put that way about the mix up potential for the vin numbers or lot numbers, good point, I'd have to agree with that.......

Just back off on me, I'm merely suggesting some possible ways that the process may have been changed to accomodate the End User, or stream line the process to allow for legal on highway travel within the laws of each state. And believe me there are ways. Anyone who disagrees should read their states laws on transport of purchased vehicles. I do believe there are in most states provisions that allow for driving of these vehicles or any vehicle from site of purchase (auctions come to mind here) to a garage of your choice to be updated and worked on to pass DOT inspections.

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Not directed at you directly!!! I just get crabby when people complain about the gl policies!! Any time you have to deal with the government or gov contractor it's going to be a pain in the rear!! Just learn to be patient and deal with it.

Sorry for being so blunt Ryan........I do apologize for ill tempered response to you. I guess I've always been a man who has never kept myself locked inside the "box" when it comes to becoming more efficient. The Military is ...............well The Military........ I have no problems with their wanting to curb the possibility of someone getting into an accident. or someone getting killed by it.

When i was in the Air Force it was " Hurry up and wait" !!!!!

grunex125 said:

Hey!!.......come on don't get crabby with me...... If you guys had read my post you would have seen that I do not in any way advocate driving these trucks illegally. bottom line is that because of the way things work out a lot of people will/have take that chance. what I am pointing out is that because of the way it works either GL or the military or whoever sets the rules for the SF-97 or base rules may have inadvertantly contributed to these activities in the past. I think......yes it is a good thing to have them trucked off base, Anyone here or wherever that has driven a truck off base has done so illegally. Further more I do not condem GL or the military for the rules.
In respect to the prior post to yours, Now that it was put that way about the mix up potential for the vin numbers or lot numbers, good point, I'd have to agree with that.......

Just back off on me, I'm merely suggesting some possible ways that the process may have been changed to accomodate the End User, or stream line the process to allow for legal on highway travel within the laws of each state. And believe me there are ways. Anyone who disagrees should read their states laws on transport of purchased vehicles. I do believe there are in most states provisions that allow for driving of these vehicles or any vehicle from site of purchase (auctions come to mind here) to a garage of your choice to be updated and worked on to pass DOT inspections.

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State laws usually have little bearing concerning ON BASE regulations. Seldom will a commander make them more relaxed than a state law, but often they are more restrictive. SOCAL bases were way ahead of CA state law banning cell phones while driving. I mean totally banning them, not even with your hands free set up (some bases might have relaxed this now). Same with radar detectors - legal in some states, but I've never driven on a base that allows them.

Once you come through those gates you're playing by a different set of rules. Driving on base (or off) is a privilege. And no rule about how you get from the GL lot to the line painted outside the base gates is set by GL.

GL can't give you a SF-97 prior to you being APPROVED for your EUC , until you are approved they can't sell you the truck per government regulations. The EUC allows for transfer of ownership so this must be done prior to the SF-97 with transfers ownership to you. It's not GL it's the government making the rules.

I picked up my new M923 in Saganaw (Ft Worth, Texas) about a month ago, and I was able to drive it off base. They even helped me jump start it!

srajetk said:

I picked up my new M923 in Saganaw (Ft Worth, Texas) about a month ago, and I was able to drive it off base. They even helped me jump start it!

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Most bases you still can drive off. A few have tightened things up.

grunex125 said:

I think......yes it is a good thing to have them trucked off base, Anyone here or wherever that has driven a truck off base has done so illegally.

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Some states do not require titles to register older vehicles. When I recovered my m1009, I drove it home, and it was registered, and insured. Not everyone who drives a truck home from auction is a law breaker.

Evil Dr. Porkchop said:

Some states do not require titles to register older vehicles. When I recovered my m1009, I drove it home, and it was registered, and insured. Not everyone who drives a truck home from auction is a law breaker.

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I agree and think you are completely correct - for the part of the recovery that was OFF BASE.

I guarantee that every base has a minimum set of requirements for someone to legally operate a vehicle on base. What is happening at MOST bases is those requirements aren't being enforced (or even thought about) because your trip starts on base.

If you stopped at the pass and decal (or whatever it is called depending on branch of service) and told them you would be operating your M1009 on base they would require you to show plenty of paperwork. Some of it would be impossible for you to provide because you don't have a title, registration, etc yet.

Since people driving MVs off a GL lot is such a small percentage of the traffic a base gets, very few bases have even thought about it. If you look at the GL website and see what all they sell, you can tell that most of their surplus is trucked off.

I don't have 1st hand knowledge, but I suspect that the bases that are actually enforcing their already in place rules (which means no drive offs) are the result of something bad happening or a close call.

Again, I'm only discussing the portion of the recovery from the GL lot to the painted line outside the gate. After that as long as your truck is road worthy and insured you should be ok.