another trans question

Hookin1

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Okay i pulled the trans out of my duece,first the input shaft was leaking,i pulled the front input shaft cover plate(forgot what it's called)the thingie the throw out bearing(need new one) rides on.it has three groves on the inside closest to the trans,is there supposed to be some kind of seal in there? next the tag on my trans has TMC inc. England......model 3043.....there is not an A behind the number but it is a overdrive trans?also,i added the winch and pto to my truck and the pto...(don't know how this could have worked out) is made by TMC also........I guess the question is......where these tranny's made to the same specs,just like the other trucks...and are the parts the same as a spicer? I have pics that i will upload later......
 

Recovry4x4

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All the same Lance. I think the TMC might just have been a rebuild depot but not sure about that. There is a gasket behind that nose cone but no seal. Sealing is accomplished via a sealed bearing That bearing should be a standard bearing shop acquisition. 3043?
 

Hookin1

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Thanx Kenny,i figured they where all the same but thought i better ask.The front bearing is bad also the throw out bearing and pilot bearing.thinking of buying the whole rebuild kit and just doing the whole thing since it's on the floor.

the input shaft had some play in it. which would explain why it was hard sometimes to get it in fourth gear(which is actually the fifth gear positon and the gear at the input shaft) the only other thing i have found besides some brass glitter in the oil when i drained it is the gear for first and reverse(the most abused gear in a trans) has the teeth corners worn down pretty good might replace it too.
 

jasonjc

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Can you buy a "rebuild kit"for these?? Surpuls or truck shop??? My new M36 need a trans , clutch and flywheel.
I have a prats truck to take them out of but don't now how good they are. It was used up by a fire dept. then sold off. How thick is a new clutch??
Thank you
 

Hookin1

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Jason,I'll find out monday on the rebuild kit..we order them at work for our trucks,i'll check the clutch tonight..i'm pulling the clutch and pressure plate this evening
 

gringeltaube

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Lance, normally our trannys don’t leak from the input shaft bearing cap, even w/o a seal. Have you checked the vent hole/valve on top of the cover? If to much pressure can build up, it could be the reason for leaking.

TMC stands for Turner Mfg Co. They rebuilt who knows how many trannys under contract for the US-Government, also converting 3052s, 5th direct into 3053s, 5th o.d. They also make their own fine transmissions, one being the same length as our 3053s, similar design but everything inside is 1.5 times stronger, 6:1 1st/rev, 0.8 o.d. and no odd 4th/5th shifting! Only draw back: no way to use/adapt our WN-7-28 winch PTO. See pic.

While you have yours disassembled, count “your” teeth: a) input shaft: 29T, b) countershaft 4th gear: 42T, c) countershaft 5th gear: 46T, d) main shaft 5th gear: 25T. If you could confirm those numbers your tranny is in fact a 3053A, 0.7871 o.d 5th. If not, let us know!

Don't worry to much if first gear set looks bad with chips missing, as long as it hasn't any teeth totally broken.

Input shaft (and main shaft) bearing is BL308ZNR , heavy duty 11 ball design, 1 shield or protector (not seal) facing inside, retaining ring outside.

May be this helps.
Gerhard
 

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houdel

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Lance - Is your trans a 3043 or a 3053? I have an Spicer English built 3053 (not 3053A) trans in my Deuce, it is an OD 5th gear, but seems to be in the .71-.75 OD range, not .79 as in the standard 3053A. I hit approx 60 MPH (actual, as verified by GPS and a chase vehicle) at 2450 RPM with my truck, vs 54 MPH @ 2600 RPM as specified in the TMs for a 3053A trans.

Gerhard - Do you have any data, especially OD ratio, on the Spicer Wolverhampton England 3053 (not 3053A) trans?
 

gringeltaube

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Lee,
I never had the chance to look inside a 3053 (no A). While open, one way to know the ratio is counting the teeth of the 4 above mentioned gears, another is mark and turn the output shaft exact 10 revs. and count the input shaft revs. 3052=10, 53A=7.9, 53=7.??

Have you noticed one of the disadvantages of these o.d. transmissions? The only way to achieve the 1.27 or greater multiplication at the output without spreading speeds to far apart is sacrificing gear reduction for R, 1st, 2nd and 3rd. That way in the 3053A, 1st is only 5.01:1 compared to the 52’s 7.55:1. 2nd is 2.78 vs. 4.18.
That also explains why you and others with an even higher o.d. ratio might have to start in 1st gear to not abuse the clutch.
 

houdel

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Gerhard - The tranny is in the truck and I don't feel like pulling the floor pan and trans top off to count teeth. I thought maybe I could put the trans in 5th, transfer case in neutral, mark the harmonic balancer and trans output flange, then crank the engine over by hand for 100 revs and count how many turns the trans output makes. Sounds like a lot of work though.

I don't know how hard it will be to crank that engine over by hand - never tried it. If its not too hard, I think four turns would be accurate enough. Four engine revs would make 3.16 turns of the trans with a .79 OD ratio, exactly 3.0 trans turns with a .75 OD ratio, and 2.84 trans turns with a .71 OD ratio. That gives me a good sense check as well, as I can easily see the difference between exactly three trans turns vs approx 1/6 turn more or less that.

My speedometer reads 10% low, my odometer reads 5% low per my GPS. Working those figures backwards leads me to conclude my 5th gear ratio is somewheres between .71 and .75. All I can say with any certainty is that an actual road speed of 60 MPH, confirmed by GPS and chase car, my tach is reading right around 2450 RPM, assuming the tach is accurate.

And yes, I do always have to start off in 1st gear. It takes way to much clutch slip to start off in second. Makes me wonder what I'll do if I ever upgrade to 11:00-20 or 12:00-20 tires!

I'll try cranking the engine over by hand and let you know how I make out.
 

houdel

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Gerhard - I went and looked at my truck, I could see the harmonic balancer but thats about it. No way I can see to get a socket in there to turn the engine over by hand without pulling the fan and radiator. Any ideas for me? Maybe do it backwards, turn the engine over from the trans output pinion? How hard is it to turn those engines over by hand? I've done it before on big V-8 gas engines, but never on anything this big!
 

Hookin1

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guys my trans is actually a spicer looks like the one on the right in the pic.the tag says tmc wolverhampton england,3053(no a) but on inspection buy a company that rebuilds truck axels and everything gear driven they confirm it is actually a spicer 3053a.....sorry it is a 3053 not a 3043.....typo :oops: i hav'nt counted the teeth yet...but here are some pics....also am working on finding out if they make a kit.......and trying to get all the part numbers for everything.
 

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gringeltaube

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Lee: After loosening all injectors you can turn the engine by the fan.
In 5th gear (TC in neutral!), turning the crankshaft 3 revs makes the output shaft turn 4, if your ratio is 0.75.
Good luck and let us know!
 

gringeltaube

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I’ve seen this before. Seems to be a weak link in the 3053s. Incorrect or contaminated lubricant could be one of the reasons.
In 5th overdrive at 2600 engine rpm the 2nd gear turns at 940 rpm on the main shaft which is doing 3300 !!! The result is a relative speed of 6.5m/sec (21ft/sec) between two gliding surfaces, shaft journal and gear, at 2360 rpm. Sure a lot of friction if the lube fails!

Gerhard
 

Hookin1

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Found my parts,went to buddy's gotta go back and pick up 2 tranny's for parts....one the inputshaft is froze at the bearing and the other somebody torched the nose of the input shaft off.....only need second gear and the out put shaft.....gonna pick one up for eddie gonna do his soon....Roger at CTC said that is a week link in the tranny,said to run synthetic in it about 50 weight should take care of the problem..
 

cranetruck

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A transmission temp gauge may not be a bad thing. An increase in the temperature of the oil
should be a good indicator of a friction problem and a pending failure.
Question is, is there a good spot for the sending unit?
 
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