Long post (questions, tips) about turboing a 6.2 with 6.5 parts

[Subourbon82]

Hey guys, long time reader, but haven't posted much here. But I like the ingenuity and work arounds I'm.reading here.

I know there's a lot of posts about these things, but here's another because I want to be sure of what I do. My goal is to bulletproof my truck. I love these old engines and want to protect it and keep it going.

So I've been collecting parts needed for a 6.5 turdbo set up on 6.2

I've done a lot of reading, I know I need injection pump turned up.
And advance 1 marks width for turbo.
I know I need to put 3/8 to 1/2 spacer on passenger side coz the 6.5 exhaust manifold interferes with the injectors. Can I do that by stacking gaskets? Or is a plate the best option?
Do i need longer bolts for the exhaust manifold to block, or will stock ones work? I can get longer bolts at the hardware store but, I also read GM exhaust manifold bolts allow for eat expansion, and tryna go home depot hardware route may warp the manifold and or damage the head, if GM makes a longer compatible bolts, what's the part number?

Unless, some of you have tips or found a way to bypass that.

Here's where I'd love input, could be a long post, but, there's so much info out there it's almost overwhelming.

At first I wasn't gonna do head studs. Or head gaskets. I don't wanna run huge boost, honestly was gonna keep it at like 7 or 8 psi just a kick in the rear to get it going.

But I think I'm playing with fire doing that, head gaskets n more vibrations so....

1. Head studs: Lotta back n forth bout head studs. ARPs torque specs are all over the place. "Don't torque to GM spec, follow ARP install instructions," "don't go with head studs, you'll get coolant leaks," "no use black permatex, it works."
"Heads studs aren't worth it" etc etc... if I do head studs. The engine is staying in, I'm not equipped to pull the engine.

Install: I've read, run clean out tap through the block, then install by hand until it bottoms out, and turn back a half a turn. And I've read install and torque to 15 ft lbs and install the gasket and head and carry on...
I know I won't be able to install the head with all studs in place coz of the cowl/shroud at firewall. So can I man handle the head, pin it there, and sneak a few studs in place to keep it there...with no AC box, batteries outta the way as well as alternator...im a big b@stard, 6ft6 and 300lbs but I'm also not a superhuman here

The permatex, only on the part of the threads making contact with the block i assume? Is less more or should I just smear it and wipe up the excess after?

And finally, I'm not really a name brand sucker. I see leroy diesel has studs too HD head studs, for cheaper (not by much but still) and apparently stronger. This is definitely a job I only want to do once, so, should I try these? (link)

Leroy Diesel
leroydiesel.com leroydiesel.com

2. Head gasket: back to leroy for a second, along with his HD head studs, he's got this thick gasket too (link)
Leroy Diesel
leroydiesel.com leroydiesel.com
I dont have any issues with my current head gaskets, at some point the heads were off though, coz, when I replaced injector, it was the short nose fine thread injectors (new style) and my truck is an 82, which should have the long nose style.

So, should I just pull the head bolts one at a time and install a stud in the correct order (depending if i should follow ARPs torque order, or GMs.)
But then I might not be able to get in there with a clean out tap or ensure good contact with permatex, and risk coolant leaks right?

3. Harmonic balancer: this comes highly recommended as a must do on our old trucks. I'd read about it before n kinda stored it in the back of my mind, but then dude I bought 6.5 manifold and turdbo off of on marketplace mentioned it again.
And, my 6.2 does have the slightest wiggle waggle when idling. Nothing crazy, I mean I've seen it shake tectonic plates when my iniection lines weren't tight enough, and it was rough idling and shaking its ass like my chocolate Labrador does when he sees a stick.

But, back to my logic, assuming steps 1, 2 go well, hot dang, ive got a turdbo. Sending more power to an already slightly shaking engine, and therefore increasing the risk of breakage, and also, its just lost power getting transferred to the mounts rather than to the drive train. And again, with a turbo, just more lost power, right?

And I don't have all the history at all of the truck so, for all I know, it's the original HB on there now.

4. Cooling: before I carry on, I've never overheated or don't have many issues with overheating. But, that's going by smell and feeling the heat off my blower motor in the cab. I don't trust my gauges one bit guys. I'd like to get those retro looking, but modern function dakota digital clusters. But anyways, maybe another post.

I dont have AC, I've got the steel fan, and an aux oil cooler installed on driver side between grille and driver side rad. Just cooler no fan.
Transmission and coolant still goes to stock rad.
With turbo, I'm gonna run hotter right? Is there a cooling upgrade i can or should be looking at?
Fan with more blades? Electric fans? Upgrade higher flowing water pump?
It'd be nice to have that buffer of cooling capabilities if needed uphill or hot summer day.
I considered getting a fan for my oil cooler, pushing air from grill side towards engine bay and mirroring that with a trans cooler on passenger side. So stock fan would pull, while 2 electric fans push.

5. Boost: assuming head studs, gaskets, HB and no overheating is just dandy. Yay. At the start of my post, way back up there, i said my intention was to run 6 or 7 lbs just to tickle it n kick it in the ass a bit. But now, I have head studs and new gasket and the super dooper harmonic balancer, soooo may as well bring up the boost gauge right?
I read guys with head studs sticking with 14 maybe 15 psi of boost, coz after that, it's the EGTs (exhaust gas temperatures) you gotta worry about, and therefore, 15psi and above, well, you're looking at an intercooler and I dunno, that's quite the can of worms.
So, assuming I've got that sweet fluidampr balancer, head studs new bitchin' head gaskets and no overheating, what numbers have you guys gotten away with, I wanna stay onnthe safe side for sure, like it's 6.2.

I apologize for the lentgh of the post. Theres head studs are a worry. I've lurked in old posts to see how install goes, and it seems to hit or miss a lot. Leaking and wrong torque coz of bad support from ARP and like I'm not pulling the engine, I try to do work myself in such a way that if im beaten I can bring it to a shop and they'll hate me but they can figure it out. But pulling heads is a big job, and I'll be paying double coz the shop will say I f'ed with it first lol.

Some guys flat out saying stick to bolts. But then, I don't want to blow the gaskets...

Harmonic balancer seems ok enough, just line it up and lots n lots of anti seize and new hardware. But this install gets alot of good feedback, proper tool, lots of lube and a good breaker bar.

The turbo install seems fun.
I'm collecting my parts n tools so I can bang it out smooth and not make 25 visits to the hardware store for tool this and part that.

So I'd love to hear your stories, dos n don't, wish I'd done this or not that. And don't spare the details. If it worked and I can do it, I wanna do it exactly like you.

Hopefully my "editing" is tolerable, I'm typing this on another cell phone, so sorry for any unclearness.
If I'm slow answering, I'm on nights at work this time around, but I like all feedback and will get back to you all.

Cheers folks, happy Thanksgiving to my Canadian readers out there, fellas, and for those in the states, it's coming! Enjoy the fall colours!

 

[Subourbon82]

Oops, the leroy diesel links did not work. My mistake

Here's the head gaskets I was referring too

Leroy Diesel

leroydiesel.com

And the HD head stud kit

Leroy Diesel

leroydiesel.com

 

[Barrman]

Lots of really good questions. I am about to walk out the door going somewhere so I can’t answer line by line at this time. Just a few comments.

The head stud issue isn’t really the potential coolant leaks of the design in my opinion as much as with the engine in the truck, you can’t install or remove the heads without removing the studs. Putting the studs back in with sealant on them through the low clearance head passageway is where the issue shows up.

Boost PSI. If you are pushing more than 5 psi in my experience then your EGT’s will be climbing. More throttle, more heat. Here is a video about it that might cover some of your questions:

I will try and do more detailed answers later.

 

[Subourbon82]

Lots of really good questions. I am about to walk out the door going somewhere so I can’t answer line by line at this time. Just a few comments.

The head stud issue isn’t really the potential coolant leaks of the design in my opinion as much as with the engine in the truck, you can’t install or remove the heads without removing the studs. Putting the studs back in with sealant on them through the low clearance head passageway is where the issue shows up.

Boost PSI. If you are pushing more than 5 psi in my experience then your EGT’s will be climbing. More throttle, more heat. Here is a video about it that might cover some of your questions:

I will try and do more detailed answers later.

I appreciate all input and answers of all lentghs!

Really 5 lbs of boost eh? Coz again, what I read, maybe it's like a guy who went fishing and caught a fish, and everytime he tells the story the fish gets bigger...
But, here and other forums, while keeping head bolts in place, not doing studs, some users claim to touch 8 to 10 psi and still be safe.
I'm on ship at work, and the wifi is good enough to post here but not quite good enough for a video. I'll keep it in mind when I get off though.

And back to EGTs, again, some users who stud their engines say you're safe up to 15 psi without needing an intercooler, but beyond that, probably a good idea to get one.

Backnto head studs for a second, I didn't know they were that tight a fit. Geez.
Coz I also considered, replacing each head bolts one by one with a head stud (in correct order or torquing etc...) But man that's just tempting fate.

Coz really, ill strip the alternator, don't have AC, I've can probably remove the inner fender, at that point I can almost stand in the engine bay and in my mind the only studs that'll Interfere will be the ones closest to firewall.
Am I right or am I not visualizing this correctly? I need to watch a video of a guy doing it.

This is also what prompted the post, I don't wanna bite off more than I can chew either and have my truck immobile in the driveway. F* that.

 

[Sharecropper]

At the risk of being flamed by the majority of members on here, I will recommend against turbo'ing your 6.2. You did not state the mileage of the engine, however if it similar to other normal '84 CUCV's, it probably has plenty. The engine was designed by GM to be a reliable, efficient powerplant at the height of the energy crisis of the early '80's. It was never designed for the higher pressures and higher stresses of a turbo. The weakness in these engines is in the bottom end main webbings - they are not robust enough for the higher horsepower obtained from a turbo. In my opinion you would be better off sourcing a new already-turbo'ed 6.5, and then adding all the CUCV accessories to that block. You stated in your original post that you wanted to "bulletproof" your engine, well, I don't believe it is possible to do that with an '84 6.2 block. If you are hail-bent to do it anyway, it is my hope that you plan to assemble the 6.2 outside the truck so you can at least take the naked block to a reputable engine shop to have it magnafluxed with the main caps torqued in place. Have those heads checked too.

I turbo'd my first 6.2 40 years ago in a brand new K30 in 1985. Wish I had that money back. Over the years, on this very forum, I have witnessed many guys just like yourself who have grandiose dreams of turning their 6.2 into a monster, Ford-eating powerhouse. After they spent tons of money and posted every detail, as soon as the project was completed with sub-par results they disappeared completely. I know the feeling, because I've been there. I'm one of those guys, however I did not disappear but instead want others to learn from my mistakes.

I apologize for being pessimistic, but will never apologize for being realistic. You asked for opinions so now you have mine. I wish you good luck and Godspeed in whatever you decide to do.

 

[Barrman]

The In Direct Injection design of the 6.2 is very inefficient with a turbo compared to Direct Injection. Think of an old Flathead V8 compared to a Hemi. IDI just doesn’t scale up very well. Don’t get me wrong, a turbo on a 6.? Is like magic compared to no turbo. But there are limitations.

A healthy engine with good head gaskets and a good cooling system will handle up to 10 psi or so and up to 1100°-1200° EGT. What speed that gives you is going to depend on your truck. My experience is I have to really, really try to even get above 8 psi at my 400 feet above sea level home elevation. Above 6,000 feet elevation and I have to back off the throttle to keep it below 10 psi on steep grades. However, boost hasn’t really ever been my problem. It is the EGT that come with the boost and the engine coolant temperature that follows about 30 seconds later. Backing off the throttle and slowing down was my only option. I added water/ methanol injection and EGT wasn’t an issue anymore. Leaving just engine coolant temperature.

There are 2 links in my signature. The Cowdog thread covers all I wrote above in much more droning on detail over several years. While the YouTube link is my boring videos about it.

I went through all of your questions myself when I was building my truck. I realized 95% or more of my expected driving would be on somewhat flat terrain. Running empty between 45-75 mph. I wanted 15-20 mpg in those conditions. While also being able to tow up to 10,000 pounds up to 60 mph and get 10 mpg doing it. To meet those goals I realized the slightly higher risk of head studs wasn’t worth it. I didn’t need to put in lower compression pistons because normally I wouldn’t be using what they provide and it would hurt my mpg and low speed dependability. I also accepted the fact that I would be the ECU. I would have to watch the gauges and settle for less power or speed in some conditions and that my foot was going to have to let up in some situations. I was ok with that when planning and now 38,000 miles into driving it I am happy with my choices. You are going to have to do a similar checklist. Then build your engine to fit what you think will be needed.

 

[Barrman]

Sharecropper posted while I was writing and I didn’t see it until mine posted. I totally agree with him. My turbo engine is a GEP block I took apart and built myself. But, I still stick to my self imposed limits and don’t worry about how fast anyone else is going.