Known fuels for the multi-fuel deuce

Basically if it is a fluid and it will burn you can run it to some degree I have run one on melted butter and margarine!

all the fules listed will run good the problems begin to happen when you run too high of a viscosity fuel in the tank with the pump not supplying enough pressure through all the filters making for harder starts. I have run limited amounts of 90 weight oil in mine no problems rand 100% 20W hyd oil engine would crank 2 or 3 times over before starting but ran fine with no ill effects. Best thing to do is if you have some oil make sure its clean and pour it in and try it. Like it has been said almost any burnable fuel will run in these engines you just have to use some common sense when it comes to viscosity.

Agreed... I have some misgivings about running straight gear lube but fortunately I only have about ten gallons so I'll probably filter it and just dump it in with a full tank of diesel / whatever else I'm running.

Karl kostman said:

Afternoon Emmado22 based upon what I read in this thread you seem very knowledgable on Fuels for the 35. Here is my question. On a data plate on my truck it states to NOT use any type of AVIATION gasoline! OK Running ANY type of gasoline in a diesel engine usually resutls in destruction of engine, I totally understand that but WHY would a gasoline of a usually higher octane rating be forbiden in this engine? The higher octane rating is made to run in higher compression engines because of its ability to reduce Pre-ignition possibilities in a gasoline engine but can you explain to me WHY this type of higher octane gasoline is Forbiden from being used in a Deuce with a LDT 465 C, I am just trying to learn WHY.

Thanks Emmado22

Karl

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I'm not who you were asking, but until you get a reply here's a little food for thought, mixed with a little opinion on the subject...
First, the Multi-Fuel engine is NOT a diesel engine. Very much similar, based on one in fact, but not the same. Your first satisfaction will come from digging into the MAN Hypercycle process. The actual mechanical changes would at first seem to be absolutely trivial, yet as one digs in a little further it becomes more clear just how significant they are. As far as drivability goes, and catastrophic combustion related events, this is where the Multi really is different. What is considered common knowledge in a gasoline or diesel engine is really not so common. So forget what you know. The properties we think of for gasoline are purely performance based, and at that they are purely based in a spark ignition engine where the fuel was A, atomized, and B, present for the entire duration of the intake and compression stroke, and well into the combustion stroke. It's only milliseconds, but when you're discussing atomized gasses and fire, it's an eternity. In the Multi, the fuel is injected in a liquid form, with most of it slobber and only a little touch of it actually atomized. It is injected into higher temperatures than it will ever see in a gasoline engine, the fire starts almost instantaneously, the atomized air/fuel mix never happens, it is simply burned from the vapors above a big "puddle". There never really is an "air/fuel charge" that would be present in a gasoline or "straight diesel" engine.
When you treat fuel that differently, you can expect it to react differently, and different properties become important or not important.
First and foremost, IMHO the resistance to ignition is irrelevant, since it is injected directly into an environment that will cause autoignition of ANY grade of gasoline instantly (provided it has available oxygen, hence the need for the "puddle" instead of atomization), even the old varnishy stuff that won't even run in a lawnmower burns in a multi.
So I suspect you will find that the reference to octane rating is nothing to do with the actual octane rating, but rather it is typically the only information available about a particular gasoline and may offer a "little window", or more like a "little peephole" into the most likely estimated makeup of the gasoline, with the different proportions of this and that hydrocarbon. From that can be deduced what will work acceptably (or not) in a multi.

Jake0147 said:

First, the Multi-Fuel engine is NOT a diesel engine. .

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A diesel engine is generally considered to be a compression ignition engine (as opposed to spark, hot bulb, etc). The multi, being a compression ignition engine, is still a diesel.

Duce Questions

I have been thinking of buying a Duce with the multi fuel engine.I have been told by the owner that he runs waste motor oil,and used transmission fluid.My question is how efficiently would it run on these fuels,and can I run them straight or do I have to cut them with desiel or gas?If so what precentige do I use?Also could a hydrogen booster be used?Or could the engine be converted to run from straight hudrogen?What are the efects on fuel milage from doing this?How much does bobbing effect milage?

walerodim said:

I have been thinking of buying a Duce with the multi fuel engine.I have been told by the owner that he runs waste motor oil,and used transmission fluid.My question is how efficiently would it run on these fuels,and can I run them straight or do I have to cut them with desiel or gas?If so what precentige do I use?Also could a hydrogen booster be used?Or could the engine be converted to run from straight hudrogen?What are the efects on fuel milage from doing this?How much does bobbing effect milage?

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Welcome to the machine. Would you please put and S behind the word question in your post

Jake0147 said:

I'm not who you were asking, but until you get a reply here's a little food for thought, mixed with a little opinion on the subject...
First, the Multi-Fuel engine is NOT a diesel engine. Very much similar, based on one in fact, but not the same. Your first satisfaction will come from digging into the MAN Hypercycle process.......

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Thanks for sticking your neck out Jake!
The multi is still a compression ignition type engine, just a slower and a more complete combustion making it a very efficient and also a relatively quiet engine. I'd love to see a complete analysis of the exhaust one day.

The viscosity of the fuel can be altered by heating or warming it, which is a necessity for veggie oils, for example.
At cold temperatures, even diesel #1 is hard to ignite and will benefit from preheating.
Don't know why "Aviation gasoline " should be avoided, though.... should be okay to use when mixed with heavier fuels IMHO.

used oil flitrashion

Their have been some post about using used moter oil and flitering realy well. My question is how do you fliter used moter oil? What is that fastest and cheepest way to go about doing that?

With all of this used motor oil talk is it ok to run synthetic motor oil? I dont have a duce yet but this is a selling point to the wife because all of my other cars use synthetic oil. And like scopionf89 asked how do you filter used oil to be clean enough to run in the truck?

scopionf89 said:

Their have been some post about using used moter oil and flitering realy well. My question is how do you fliter used moter oil? What is that fastest and cheepest way to go about doing that?

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There are many posts specifically on this topic via search but when you say "fastest and cheapest" way its usually one or the other. Cheapest I've seen is letting it heat up in the sun and squeezing it through a pair of jeans (YMMV). Fastest is probably a centrifuge plus it gets water out. But you can work up anything in between. I'm sure more guys will chime in.

Has anyone run compressor oil?

I have been adding more alternative fuels gradually to my truck. I started by adding about a gallon WMO to about a quarter of a tank of diesel and all I noticed was that it ran a little smoother and seemed a little quieter. When I needed to refuel I added about 10 gallons of some nice clean used cooking oil that I let sit in the sun and settle for a while then filtered along with about 10 gallons of diesel. Making it about a 50/50 mix. I have had no problems and the truck is running fine. I let my wmo and wvo sit for a while in the direct sun and get hot and settle very well. I then run it through a double paint filter. They cost .19 cents each at my local ACE Hardware. So if I filter say 10 gallons of wmo or wvo my cost is 38 cents. I would be interested in having members share other (simple) low cost filter methods with the group.

it's kind of scarry the first time you dump wmo in the tank,is'nt it? ive been filtering wmo for a couple of mo's now so i'll have some low cost fuel for the 900 mile round trip im about to make to the Ga. rally, so far i have about 60 gal and will do another 55 gal drum by rally time. to filter wmo you need to filter down to at least 5 microns,go to lowes or home depot and and you can find all the parts to build a filter setup , you can use the 5 micron string wound water filtration filters,they work well and are cheap,you can get the canaster they go with as well , what i did was build a set up with a 5 gal bucket and some 3/4" sced 80 grey pvc with two of the string filters inside that slide down over two up rights that have a bunch of holes drilled through them screwed into a horzontal manafold which runs through the side of the bucket with a ball valve on the outside and a elbow that turns down , i sit bucket on top of the 55 gal drum with the elbow stuck through the hole of the drum and let gravity do the rest, it will filter 5 gal in about 40 min, this setup works well and will even seperate out some water because theres about 2" of space between the bottom of the filters and the bottom of the bucket for the water to settle out, i also plan to use a pump/inclosed filter setup to circulate the allready filtered wmo through the drum to pollish it before use, also stuck some earth magnets to the side of my primary fuel filter to snag any stray metal .

maddawg308 said:

From what I've been told, yes, but you must filter it well...

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Beware waste motor oil that has not been personally processed. A member here used some that was filtered by the provider, but still had anti-freeze in it, and it ruined the engine during a summer trip with his wife across New Mexico. During the attempt to repair and get the truck back on the road, the gentleman had a very serious heat stroke out there. This is nothing to fool around with.

What is the process for making sure water and antifreeze is removed from waste motor oil?

In the posts that i have read, it seems that most heat up their oil to burn off the water and then cetrafuge the oil to get rid of the other stuff.

heat will speed the seperation of water from the oil, the oil will float ontop to you cna drain the water from the bottom of your container. you can also use fuel filters with water seperators when filtering before using.

Been running 90 to 95 percent waste oil in my truck for about 8 months now. I screen it then run it to 10 micron and a water separator then into the tank.

It seems to run cooler, quieter and just plain nicer on oil. You do loose a bit of power with it but nothing keeps you from hitting 56 without issue.

My filters have been lasting about 4 tanks worth and cost about 16 bucks each. Usually it is water contamination that eats them so let the stuff sit for a week or so before pumping.

VARYAG - can you take a picture of what the filter(s) looks like right before you toss it/them? I'd like to see what it looks like?

Just to clarify, not the truck filters but the screen system filters. I change them when they stop letting oil through.