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Battery charging?

reiters

Member
65
14
8
Location
TX
So I haven't put a meter on everything but the charge meter is always showing negative when the genset is running. Does that mean it's drawing more than charging? I would assume that it's not charging at all and using the battery a bit. i don't remember the amps in the negative. The batteries seem to continue to work and start the unit fine but I only use it for a few hours at a time maybe every other month. I did run the batteries to zero once leaving the CP lights on for 5 days. They charged back up just fine once the charger was done having a heart attack.

Side note, I will be putting a led light strip in there or at least leds in the bulb sockets in the near future. I don't need to be sneaky with little green lights that produce almost no light at all.

I am having an electrician replace my breaker box next week and going to have him wire the genset into the panel. Would it be advisable to run 120v into the genset for convenience. Maybe to hook up battery tenders for 24/7 topoff of batteries?

The unit is a MEP-004 utility with sx460 regulator.

Something else I'm thinking about is creating a governor out of an arduino and stepper motor. I could put a frequency sense circuit in and adjust the throttle via stepper. I would have to have lots of safety protocols in place to make sure it doesn't run away if the code has a glitch. I'm just not sure how fast the response time will be. If I try to adjust fast I run the risk of overshooting and "searching". Too slow and there may not be a point. Other issue is that I don't know if I'll ever load the thing enough to need anything better than manual throttle.

I have to add one more thing in case someone comes here and doesn't know about them. I initially wired my genset in to my panel myself knowing it wasn't code. I knew the main MUST be off before kicking the genset breaker on. I know that's BAD but it worked well. I didn't want to spend $400+ on a manual transfer switch but I didn't know any alternative. I just ran across an alternative. Generator Interlocks are little metal things that set on the face of your breaker panel and wont let you have the genset breaker on at the same time as the main. Physically can be done. If you buy a brand name one it will be NEMA approved and should pass code. They are expensive for a little piece of stamped metal ($50) but worth it. The new panel I have going in is a 200 amp 42 slot square-d and the interlock kit is made by square-d for my panel. I hope this helps someone else that is struggling with cost vs safety. I had never heard of them.
 

Triple Jim

Well-known member
1,373
277
83
Location
North Carolina
Put a volt meter on your battery when you run the generator. That will tell you if the voltage is coming up (charging) or going down (discharging).

I suspect that trying to servo the engine speed will not be worth the effort, since the original system is pretty good, and a Hz or two off of 60 won't be noticed unless you have a lot of old motor driven clocks around, but... you'll need to be able to adjust the proportional feedback constant to make it sensitive, but not unstable. You'll probably also want some integral feedback to slowly step it to right on 60 Hz when the load is steady. Depending on just how things are set up, some derivative feedback could help with suddenly changing loads, but a little too much of that can make an actuator very nervous. Writing your code to allow reasonably easy adjustment of the three constants will allow you to tune the control system for good operation. The last time I did it, I had a control panel "setup mode", and could set P, I, and D with button presses, with their values shown with blinks of an LED.
 

reiters

Member
65
14
8
Location
TX
"since the original system is pretty good"

Does the utility have a mechanical governor? I though that was only the precision units. Maybe the precision has a better governor. It was my understanding that the utility model was a fixed throttle set by me at startup.
 

Korgoth1

New member
191
2
0
Location
radford, va
The precise units keep the hertz tighter for sensitive equipment, not necessary for civilian application. I had one and really it only kept it 2 hertz tighter, not really worth it.

You need to check the cable connector on the back of the alternator, mine came loose just a bit and quit charging.
 

Korgoth1

New member
191
2
0
Location
radford, va
Mine, after so many hours, went haywire. Luckily I was present and nothing burned up. I disconnected the electronic govener after that.
 

2hot6ft2

New member
16
1
3
Location
Grant, AL
Instead of running a cord to plug in a battery tender I use one of these solar panels from eBay "Brunton Solarflat 5W / 24V Solar Amorphus" sometimes it's easier to find by searching by the Item # 370952748706 seems really sturdy and well made too. Price is reasonable at about $30 IMO.

When testing the batteries it's a good idea to test them independently since a dead cell in 1 battery will drain the other until it becomes damaged as well. When facing the instrument panel disconnect the battery in the left side doors + terminal. Then test each battery for 12+ volts. The reason for disconnecting that terminal is that the other end of that cable goes to the - terminal of the other battery so if it touches the case, frame etc. it wont short since it's the negative anyway.
 

reiters

Member
65
14
8
Location
TX
I love all the input on the governor. I will ditch the idea.

As for the solar charger, I would love to but my yard is filled with big oaks so no sun hits the ground.

I will check the alternator wires. I checked the fuse a while back.

Thanks all!
 

Triple Jim

Well-known member
1,373
277
83
Location
North Carolina
"since the original system is pretty good"

Does the utility have a mechanical governor? I though that was only the precision units. Maybe the precision has a better governor. It was my understanding that the utility model was a fixed throttle set by me at startup.
Korgoth1 pretty much said it, but yes, it has a mechanical governor that should keep the frequency within plus or minus 1 or 2 Hz with varying load.
 

lonesouth

Active member
322
29
28
Location
Tallahassee, FL
Instead of running a cord to plug in a battery tender I use one of these solar panels from eBay "Brunton Solarflat 5W / 24V Solar Amorphus" sometimes it's easier to find by searching by the Item # 370952748706 seems really sturdy and well made too. Price is reasonable at about $30 IMO.
Link to quoted solar panel.

Are you running it straight to the batteries, or using a charge controller?

I am planning to use this charge controller with a 24v 10w panel.
 
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