Deuce cranks, wont start #1000

[sturkopp]

Hi folks,
I introduce myself, my name is Thierry, Im french-norwegian hybrid and live in Germany, have had M1009, M275, M151 and now got sticked to the M35. Im reading here for quite a long time,but never posted much anxious for my poor english, hope you dont mind.

My deuce ran fine 2 weeks ago,now its a no starter, been working on it since then with no result, I ran through almost every thread that the search for "deuce wont start" spit out and checked following things:

-tank 3/4 full
-in-tank pump is working
-fuel filters have a few hundret miles, rechecked them, they are fine
-fuel comes through return line
-shut-off moves, I opened the side cover, the linkage moves also
-took of the hydraulic head, plunger moves up and down, turns smooth, the square thing... i dont know what its called... moves up and down from its own weight
-always thought starter cranks a bit slow, removed it, it was completely shot, replaced it, now it cranks really fast
- flame heater works as i heard a few puffs inside the intake manifold
- it will start on break cleaner but runs only a few turns then dies
-no smoke from exhaust only a little mist from the flame heater

all this brings me to the conclusion it doesnt get fuel but why?



what can I check else?

 

[212sparky]

Have you cracked the lines at the injectors to check for fule?

 

[sturkopp]

there was no fuel in the pressure lines when i removed the hydraulic head why I asumed the problem had to be inside the pump
after remounting the HH I didnt think of that because nothing changed

 

[sturkopp]

Will check that tomorrow, its 10 pm over here, its freezing outside and my batteries are down cause i cranked them to death so i have to charge them overnight

 

[212sparky]

Does the plunger in the HH move when you crank it. I know you said it did when off. But if it is not moving while all bolted up you may have a sheared key on the drive gear.

 

[sturkopp]

Ah, OK! thanks, good advice

 

[212sparky]

Remove the bolt in the center and place a small dowel rod in there to check for travel.

 

[gimpyrobb]

You could also pull the injector lines off and see if fuel spirts up from each fuel supply hole in the hydraulic head.

 

[glcaines]

You could also pull the injector lines off and see if fuel spirts up from each fuel supply hole in the hydraulic head.

Ditto.

Also, the engine should start easily if everything is correct. Be careful you don't burn up your new starter trying to start it.

 

[gimpyrobb]

I have also found on a couple trucks (that I've had the IP apart) that I've needed to use a whiff of starting fluid to get it to initially start, then its fine on its own after that.

 

[stampy]

gasoline on a rag over the air intake actually works really well and it isnt as big of a hit as either. Just make sure it is damp NOT soaked. The fumes should help ignite any fuel that is being injected. If it doesn't work then you have no fuel being injected or you aren't turning the crank fast enough (ie dead batteries)

 

[sturkopp]

Today I reopened the Hydraulic head as suggested, the plunger moves well up and down (inside, all bolted together) cracked the lines and finally pulled all injectors out, to my surprise it doesnt suffer from no fuel but from too much, Injectors were soaking wet with unburned fuel, they are all covered with a thick oily film like if you had them plunged in waste motor oil (which is basically what i have in the tank , filtered and mixed up 50/50 with diesel and gasoline)

So I cranked and nice squirts coming from each pressure line except the first which is a little weaker
dissasembled and cleaned the injectors to make sure there is none stuck then all back in -- no start

could there be so much unburned fuel from cranking in the chambers that this is the point??
had to recharge the batts again, hope It will not kill my new starter

 

[gimpyrobb]

Yup, might need to take the injectors in to have them adjusted. They should check the spray pattern and pop pressure. Might want to crank the motor over with the injectors out to see if any fuel sprays out of the holes.

 

[sturkopp]

Got it started this afternoon with loads of brake cleaner, it idled very bad, no power, it did not more than 25 mph in fourth at full throttle with clattering noises, sounded like valves, then a big crunchy noise and died, water was cooking(after two miles), the rear head was hot as ****
Luckily the logging guys were near and pulled me home...............we`ll see tomorrow

 

[gimpyrobb]

Time for a leak down test.

 

[sturkopp]

I´m a dumbass, hydraulic head wasn`t aligned as it should
... the one tooth on right of the mark-thing in the upper timing window...
clatteriing noise must have been the injectors pushed back by too advanced timing, i think thats also were the heat came from,
remounted the HH making sure everything is correct this time and pumped out the tank and replaced by pure diesel,
now it starts at 4-5 turns with a very little throttle but it still idles bad, going up and down
I drove about a mile down the road with no issues and it began to sputter on my way back, rpms going up and down, dies when i push the clutch pedal

 

[67 evil eleanor]

Time to look at your fuel filters, all 3. Check the first one (under the front of the engine) and see if there's any water in it and then change the filter. Then move on to the two that are on the engine. You will need to change them and clean out the housing bottoms and check the drain valves and make sure they will open and not clogged up.

 

[gimpyrobb]

I have had the "hunting idle" issue. Best recommendation for that is some "sea foam" fuel additive(if its over there) and driving it. Seems the governors don't like sitting much and this is the result. I'd try taking it out for a good 2hr drive.

 

[sturkopp]

As I said the filter are all fine, no sludge in the bottom, drain valves are free, but i remarked that the fuel line between HH (return side) and the fitting on the 2. filter is foamy, seems to suck air into the system somewhere
pump "in" lines have no foam

what is this sea foam stuff? Only thing I know is some additives they use in boats against all the bio-crap, is this the same?

 

[sturkopp]

by the way, thats how i bought it


and after 1 year of restauration on a show

and with the MUTT on the back