• Steel Soldiers now has a few new forums, read more about it at: New Munitions Forums!

  • Microsoft MSN, Live, Hotmail, Outlook email users may not be receiving emails. We are working to resolve this issue. Please add support@steelsoldiers.com to your trusted contacts.

ECO Hubs Who needs 3:07 gears?

P

Poolboy 7631

Member
Just finished a test drive with xengineguy and his M1078. Told him I would post my review in a day or two but I can't wait. First part of the drive was through the field and up a 35 to 40 degree embankment. We went into mode, down into 1st gear and basically idled up without much more than a tap on the throttle to get the truck rolling. I can't imagine not having enough torque, power, etc for anything I would ask my truck to do. If I need to do something that seriousl and in need of what is lost by Then out to the 2 lane and even with the limited am ount of time I have driven my truck I knew I needed to be ready for 2-3 neck jerking shift that NEVER happened. Then coasting up to the stop, again no harsh downshift. Then 60 mph at between 1500-1800 rpm, I couldn't believe what I was seeing and NOT hearing the exact rpm at 60 didn't register in my brain. Speaking of not hearing, that is the part that struck me the most right now. My wife was along for the ride and commented she could enjoy riding in the truck now. The entire time we carried on a normal level of conversation. Half the engine and drivetrain noise and NONE of the 2:1 gear reduction noise. In time I will realize and appreciate the many other benefits (fuel mileage, wear and tear, etc). I will agree with generaldisorder that this mod and A/C (in my future) will be the best 2 upgrades you can do for your trucks. Thanks xengineguy for this and the opportunity to drive your truck. It was a pleasure meeting you and your wife (and Abby).
 
R

Ronmar

Well-known member
GeneralDisorder said:
All the shifts are very smooth. The 2-3 shift is noticably softer, and all the downshifts are also very gentle.
Click to expand...
Yea, I THINK because of the 2:1 out in the hubs, the torque converter is really underutilized unless you are really trying to start a very heavy load. So you step on the pedal and the engine RPM ramps right up, and the turbine follows right along as you accelerate smartly because it has a real advantage over the work being performed. But the TC is reactionary, you don’t get that hydraulic torque multiplication unless it is really loaded,

So when you hop into 3rd, and the engine RPM and turbine RPM are still increasing nicely, the controller says go ahead and engage lockup, except there is still quite a difference between engine and turbine, which of course gets absorbed by the head snap when LU makes these RPMs one:) I suspect this is probably because the lockup engagement time is setup/programmed for a greater load…

So when we drop the 2:1 off the hubs, we give the TC a greater load, which forces greater TC multiplication and a load that may be more appropriate for the LU engagement programming…
 
G

GeneralDisorder

Well-known member
Steel Soldiers Supporter
Ok back from the mileage test run.

Conditions were:

53 degrees (F)
Interstate 5 from the Aurora Flying-J Truck Stop RV pump #26 to center of town in Lebanon Oregon, and back. 118 miles round trip.
Both vehicles used the same pump (same ground angle) before and after the test run and both were filled just till bubbles would not come up to the fill neck.
1st test vehicle: 2008 M1079 A1R with C7 @ 370 HP / 931 TQ with ECO Hubs.
2nd test vehicle: 2003 M1078 A1 with 3126b @ 330 HP / 870 TQ with stock reduction hubs.
1st vehicle in the lead with cruise control set at 55 mph.

ECO Hubs: 11.58 gallons used. 10.189 MPG
Stock Reduction: 17.12 gallons used. 6.89 MPG

ECO Hub fuel economy improvement of 3.299 MPG

I did the math - at that savings the hubs will pay for themselves in 3,203 miles. And the reduction of wear and tear on the drivetrain and the other benefits I will try to outline below are incalculable.

Other notes:

Non ECO Hub vehicle engine was screaming at redline to keep up and the radiator fan ran every 2 minutes (we timed it) once it got up to temp. The ECO Hub truck never ran it's radiator fan the entire day (including a high speed run later in the day) of driving around 150 miles.

ECO Hub truck is extremely quiet in the cab. Engine feels like it's VERY happy. Entire drivetrain feels like it's happier. The hubs are cold or barely warm to the touch.

In testing on a very familiar hill near my house where my truck would previously only do about 37-38 at max effort, the ECO Hubs flew up the hill at 45 and I had to back out of the throttle.

Acceleration is better - my truck was always fast off the line with the 370 HP map but now it's fast AND smooth. The 2-3 shift is more like the other shifts.

On the C7 trucks (and I suspect this will be the same for the 3126b trucks) the speedo is driven by the engine ECM and since this also controls exhaust brake minimum engagement speed, cruise control minimum speed and logic, etc - once I programmed the pulses per mile from 62,618 to 31,309 everything simply worked. Speedo, cruise, exhaust brake, etc.

Transmission behaves exactly as it should. 7th shift doesn't happen till you get a bit over 60 MPH. When coming to a longer grade on the freeway the cruise would lean into the throttle very gently and then the trans would downshift to 5th at times to maintain 55 mph. It works perfectly.

After the test on the way home I dropped the hammer on it (not speed limited by my tires - they are new), and hit 85+ mph. I backed off. It had more in it.

BTW the C7 MMDC canbus guage tops out at 80. I was definitely going faster. Not sure how much faster - I was watching the road :oops:

For the record my truck is very smooth at 80. It's a bit unnerving going that fast in this machine. You can also see where my temp gauge is sitting - that's where it was all day. Meanwhile the poor 3126 truck was cycling the fan every 2 minutes.

The fellow member who owns the M1078 used in this test was so excited by the results he ordered a set on the spot.

Conclusion - IDK how many sets he has left but GET THESE NOW! Throw the reduction hubs in the nearest lake. F that mess they are worthless.

PXL_20230424_010239411.jpg
 
Last edited:
G

GeneralDisorder

Well-known member
Steel Soldiers Supporter
Xengineguy said:
:):)So I guess you kind of like the Eco Hubs? Thanks so much for the update! I’ve got to get new tires!
Click to expand...
Beyond like. This is an absolute game changer. This changes everything. It rolls back the cost of driving these to pre-pandemic cost levels. 32% increase in fuel economy. That's absolutely HUGE in the world of fuel economy gains.

Mind = Blown. 🤯
 
Jeep Nasty

Jeep Nasty

Active member
Looking forward to them, I’m ordering mine once I get back from my vacation for my m1087

I’ll be curious to see the improvement with running the Cat 3116. And obviously more weight with the Expansible box on the back.

I am curious how this will affect its overland performance as on light off road situations

This thing isn’t a rock crawler, but I don’t want to diminish its abilities to get to n and out of remote locations




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
DeMilitarized

DeMilitarized

Well-known member
Jeep Nasty said:
Looking forward to them, I’m ordering mine once I get back from my vacation for my m1087

I’ll be curious to see the improvement with running the Cat 3116. And obviously more weight with the Expansible box on the back.

I am curious how this will affect its overland performance as on light off road situations

This thing isn’t a rock crawler, but I don’t want to diminish its abilities to get to n and out of remote locations




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Do the governor modification to increase the off the line power and it drives way different.
 
Jeep Nasty

Jeep Nasty

Active member
DeMilitarized said:
Do the governor modification to increase the off the line power and it drives way different.
Click to expand...
Do you have a link on how to do that? This is my first military truck of the FMTV platform or cat 3116.

I’ve done a bunch of the fuel pump turn ups on n 8.3L Cummins motors on the five tons.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
DeMilitarized

DeMilitarized

Well-known member
Jeep Nasty said:
Do you have a link on how to do that? This is my first military truck of the FMTV platform or cat 3116.

I’ve done a bunch of the fuel pump turn ups on n 8.3L Cummins motors on the five tons.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I just took a chisel and hammered on the outside of the big cover rather than make a custom tool. Super fast and simple. I went a bit further than he said in the video bc I have a 220hp version but it made the off the line performance feel like I gained 80hp or more.
 
Xengineguy

Xengineguy

Well-known member
Supporting Vendor
Mk23 said:
Any install videos yet? I saw it mentioned, but didn't see any links. Thanks
Click to expand...
Not yet, I’ve got a couple of customers that have offered to do a video. It takes a little time to get everything ready and do it.
Im sure someone will come thru soon.. if not I will add it to my list.

Got about 50 hubs going to heat treat tomorrow.
24 back from heat treat Monday and took them to EDM. 50 adapter plates cut, welded and sent to CNC for drill, tap.
This run of plates will have a drain/fill hole . Also will have a threaded hole 5/16 - 18 to help break the silicone bond
between the inner hub and plate for easy removal. Thanks to everyone for sharing ideas to continue to improve this product!
Will be shipping again soon!
 
T

tennmogger

Well-known member
Steel Soldiers Supporter
Got my set and installation was completed a few days ago. The truck drives fantastic as described in other posts so I won't duplicate.

If you have any concern about needing a video, you probably don't. The process is simple and covered well by the included instructions. One note though, the threaded holes in the hub from which the original cover unbolted (12 bolts) were full of sealant and other crud, probably a buildup from many hub removal cycles. I discovered the longer new bolts bottomed out before tight. Suggest using a drill bit to clean the holes to the bottoms (I used a size M) then chase the threads with a 3/8-16 tap.

A great product!!
 
Xengineguy

Xengineguy

Well-known member
Supporting Vendor
tennmogger said:
Got my set and installation was completed a few days ago. The truck drives fantastic as described in other posts so I won't duplicate.

If you have any concern about needing a video, you probably don't. The process is simple and covered well by the included instructions. One note though, the threaded holes in the hub from which the original cover unbolted (12 bolts) were full of sealant and other crud, probably a buildup from many hub removal cycles. I discovered the longer new bolts bottomed out before tight. Suggest using a drill bit to clean the holes to the bottoms (I used a size M) then chase the threads with a 3/8-16 tap.

A great product!!
Click to expand...
Thanks for the feedback. You will enjoy your truck so much more now!
 
Xengineguy

Xengineguy

Well-known member
Supporting Vendor
An update for everyone following this project. Just completed another run of Drive plate adapters. Better finish on metal
surfaces, added a drain/fill hole. Also added a 5/16x18 threaded hole to help remove the drive plate when needed. All the new sets
IMG_2152.jpegIMG_2150.jpegIMG_2147.jpeg
will ship with these new features! Thanks.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top