Electric Gremlin-- M1009

[portert0224]

Ok, I've followed the -20 and -30 and cannot seem to get any power when the key is turned to the run or start position. Any "new" advice is greatly appreciated. Here is the history.

Truck started at Lejeune auction site. Drove it 5 1/2 hours back to Virginia with no problems. Have been driving it daily 20-50 miles per day for about a month.

Last Sat, my daughter started it and drove it about 1/4 mile and it just stopped running. No unusual noises or warnings in advance, just stopped running while she was driving down the road. From that point on, I cannot get any power from the key "run" or "start" position. None of the usual buzzers or warning lights when turned to the run position and nothing when turned to the start position (no wait light, glow plug selenoid clunk, etc) that we know we are supposed to get when the key is turned .

Followed the -20 trouble shooting. Checked all under dash fuses first--all good. Did not see any burnt fusible links or wires on the firewall. The truck has 24 volts at the batteries, 24 volts at the selenoid, no lose wires on the starter or selenoid. Replaced the starter relay--did not fix the problem..

Followed the -30 and replaced the starter switch on top of the steering--didn't fix the problem.

When I was replacing the starter switch, I noticed that about 1" below the connector, there was a red wire that had the plastic covering rubbed through from contact over the years with the dash frame. It wasn't melted or burned, but did show signs of arcing, so I cut this out (maybe 1/4" of length) and I crimped in a connector and finished replacing the starter switch.

I totally disassembled the entire instrument panel and cleaned everything up. I removed all of the lights, cleaned them up and checked them for continuity--they were all good. I cleaned all of the copper connections on the instrument circuit board with vinegar and a Q-tip. I reconnected the instrument panel (it looks like new now) and reconnected the instrument panel connector to test the key cylinder to see if I got any buzzers or lights when I turned the key to the on position. Nothing. I turned the key to the start position and nothing.

I really don't have a clue as to wear to proceed from here. It seems that the problem is not between the starter switch and fuse box, or there would have been a blown ignition fuse. It doesn't seem to be a problem between the selenoid and starter relay because it has voltage at the selenoid switch and I replaced the starter relay.

Anybody ever had a similar problem? Is it possible that the starter IS bad and somehow completes the circult at the switch? Anybody know what the red wire going from the starter switch (looks like it goes behind the fuse box and I presumed this to go into the 30 amp ignition switch fuse)?

I loathe the thought of having to tow it into Mr. Goodwrench if I can't fix it myself. I can only imagine the bill for "troubleshooting" this vehicle.

Thanks in advance,
Tracy

 

[Mike_Pop]

Are you getting power from the batteries to the starter? Check your connections on the power blocks. Is your pink wire broken or shorting out? Did you replace any fusible links since you cannot always tell by looking at them if they are blown.

I've found that the TM with the electrical diagram is incredibly helpful. You might want to start with the batteries and trace your way to the starter and dash.

Just some thoughts.

 

[portert0224]

Re: RE: Electric Gremlin-- M1009

Are you getting power from the batteries to the starter? Check your connections on the power blocks. Is your pink wire broken or shorting out? Did you replace any fusible links since you cannot always tell by looking at them if they are blown.

I've found that the TM with the electrical diagram is incredibly helpful. You might want to start with the batteries and trace your way to the starter and dash.

Just some thoughts.

Thanks for the quick response. I have power at the bus bars on the firewall behind the rear battery. I was thinking the same thing as you about the fusible links. I don't see any that look swollen or melted, but that doesn't always mean anything. But, do you know of a better way of checking power to a sealed fusible link like on the CUCVs without cutting the wire at the link or poking a test tip through the insulation?

Ahhh yes....electrical diagrams.......just poke me in the eye now with a sharp stick. I have never learned how to read those things.

For kicks and grins, I'm going to buy a new starter because that is what the -20 trouble shooting steps said was wrong with it, but that didn't make sense to me because I don't see how that has anything to do with the "run" key position not powering the wait light and other dash lights that used to cut on when the key was turned to the run position.

 

[Mike_Pop]

RE: Re: RE: Electric Gremlin-- M1009

I'm no electrical guru. Just wanted to get that out there.

I would really consult the wiring diagrams before spending the money on a starter. If the truck died while driving, it's not the starter. You can check the fusible links with an ohmmeter, test for resistance from one end of the wire to the other.

Are your alternators charging? How much voltage do you have at each battery?

If you want to call me tomorrow, feel free to. I can look at my CUCV and follow along with you.

Remember, I am no genius when it comes to fixing things but I manage. And, since nobody else replied, I'm more than willing to help.

 

[portert0224]

RE: Re: RE: Electric Gremlin-- M1009

My alternators were charging fine before it died. Both batteries have 12.7 volts. Not all of the fusible links have an open end where I can touch with a meter, so testing the fusible links is going to be tough. I'm going to look at the wiring diagrams, but due to my mon-fri work, I probably won't get to it again until the weekend. I will probably take the starter off and have a guy I know that rebuilds starters and alternators test it out first. I really appreciate the help. All of this is a royal PITA, but it is definitely the best way to learn and know your vehicles, IMHO.

 

[ida34]

RE: Re: RE: Electric Gremlin-- M1009

The starter is not going to cause your dash lights not to come on and such. You need to track the power from the batteries both in the 24 volt side and the 12 volt side from to the ground in the ignition circuit. I know you say that you do not work well with wiring diagrams but you are going to have to start or toss this off to someone else to check out for you.

 

[Tibby]

RE: Re: RE: Electric Gremlin-- M1009

I had a somewehat similar problem with mine. I was unloading some things at a storage unit one night after dark. I had left the truck running with the lights on. When I was finished, I realized that the engine was still running, but I had no lights whatsoever. None, as if I had flipped the blackout light switch, which I didn't. I managed to get home without encountering anyone in the law enforcement community. It was winter and I didn't have a garage to work in and I couldn't figure it out. A regular shop I had it towed to (and given them a copy of the wiring diagram) threw up their hands. I planned to have it towed back home, but the tow truck driver said there was a good electrical guy back in their shop who might be able to fix it. I gave him a shot. It was a diode failure. I wasn't good with the wiring diagrams, or I might have diagnosed it myself. I am somewhat better at it now.

 

[Michael]

RE: Re: RE: Electric Gremlin-- M1009

The first thing I would check, is to see if you have 12 volts at the 12 volt buss on the firewall. It is next to the glow plug relay. It connects to the ground wire of the back battery and has a fusible link in it if my memory serves me correctly. The left side alternator connects here also.

the next thing I would check is to see if you have 12 volts at the fuss block under the dash. You have a break in your 12 volt power supply. You are going to have to start at the source and follow it out to the break. Your starter has nothing to do with this.

 

[jld66]

I had a problem almost exactly like yours. My truck was running fine when I parked it one day. The next time I tried to start it Nothing! There was no power to the dash or nearrly anywhere else inside. Batteries checked OK. I chased cirucits per the wiring diagram wiith an ohm meter or test light for days. Finally had it towed to a guy who specializes in CUCVs and HMMWVs who got it running. He never did tell me just what the problem was, but it was either a bad ground or a bad (corroded) connection somewhere under the hood. This fellow has a special knack for electrical problems, but according to his son who works with him, it took him a while to find the problem. HIs son told me that he just went into the shop alone with a bunch of little jumper wires and messed with it until he found the problem.

I don't think a Goodwrench shop will be much help since it would be rare for one of them to have a mechanic with much experience with military vehicles.

Good luck, I feel your pain!

 

[CCATLETT1984]

I'll vote that your ignition switch on the steering column may have died. that would cause the immediate engine stall and no power, since the pink wire the keeps the shutoff solenoid open is feed from an igniton hot.

 

[rfischba1]

Would a short in the heater switch/motor cause the same problems, engine dies, no power /lights, nothing. Fuses maybe blown???