M416 trailer: were there Magnesium wheels on the early ones??

[nealseale]

I have a 416 Serial number 160, date of manufacture 28—8-62.
The previous owner sold it on ebay and I noticed several comments after the sale saying the wheels were worth the price I paid for it because they are magnesium. well, I have no clue how to tell but they are not the same as regular m416 wheels, or off another vehicle, and are not metal as no magnet will stick to them.
Yet I’ve never heard of this, Any one have an answer or a place to refer me as I have not had any luck so far.
Thanks for reading.
I’m new to this so I’m trying to post pictures.

 

[NDT]

Magnesium wheels came on early M151 Mutt 1/4 ton trucks. People that are restoring these vehicles desire these wheels as the Army started using steel wheels, and these got replaced. I personally don’t think 416s came with those wheels but I was not there in 1961.

 

[msgjd]

wow this is news to me .. Had driven and been around many M151's, A1's and A2's during my lengthy service .. Never saw no other than the typical round-hole steel rims on mutt-related stuff .. this is very interesting and making me want to re-visit old pics etc

 

[M813rc]

They could be Mighty Mite wheels, they are interchangeable bolt pattern and size wise. Mites had magnesium wheels for light weight.
The M416B1 was the specified trailer for the Mite, but I don't know enough about the history of them to say whether they always had magnesium wheels.

Cheers

 

[MAKOTO MATSUMIYA]

nealseale:
This picture is from a TM(1970), does the your M416 also have the BO stop light on the right side as shown in the picture?

 

[msgjd]

View attachment 955313
NDT:
This picture is from a TM(1970), does the your M416 also have the BO stop light on the right side as shown in the picture?

I have an M416 as well but i am pretty sure it has steel wheels but this post has me curious to double-check... Most trailers & wheeled vehicles still having the metal lamps had them replaced by the composite type in the 1980's , thus on older M416's the individual BO-stop lamp seen in the TM pic was removed but the bracket bolt holes for it would still be there.. My M416 has the composites thus no individual BO-stop lamp however in the army i recall every M416 and all other tactical trucks and trailers still having metal lamp housings had the individual BO-stop.. They had to.. I realize in the 1950's-early 60's that wheeled tactical items without directional signals had just one tail/brake/BO-tail lamp, and on the right was the BO-tail/stop lamp housing as was on tracked vehicles , however my experience since the mid-70's, the 1950's-early 60's wheeled vehicles in motorpools i was in had 2 metal tail/stop/bo-tail housings, plus the individual BO-stop .. By the 80's most if not all of those finally got the composite lamps .. This depended on unit, however. Some were late to ditch the metal housings

 

[MAKOTO MATSUMIYA]

I have an M416 as well but i am pretty sure it has steel wheels but this post has me curious to double-check... Most trailers & wheeled vehicles still having the metal lamps had them replaced by the composite type in the 1980's , thus on older M416's the individual BO-stop lamp was removed but the bracket bolt holes for it would still be there.. My M416 has the composites thus no individual BO-stop lamp however in the army i recall every M416 and all other tactical trucks and trailers still having metal lamp housings had the individual BO-stop.. They had to.. I realize in the 1950's-early 60's that wheeled tactical items without directional signals had just one tail/brake/BO-tail lamp, and on the right was the BO-tail/stop lamp housing as was on tracked vehicles , however my experience since the mid-70's, the 1950's-early 60's wheeled vehicles in motorpools i was in had 2 metal tail/stop/bo-tail housings, plus the individual BO-stop .. By the 80's most if not all of those finally got the composite lamps .. This depended on unit, however. Some were late to ditch the metal housings

TM9-2330-251-14(1970)


TM9-2330-251-14(1990)

msgjd:
Thank you very much for the valuable information.

The TM says magnesium wheels, but I have never seen the M416 trailers with magnesium wheels.
What I would like to know is when production of the M416 trailer began, and whether the early production models
had tail lights without turn signals like the WWII～M100 trailers.

 

[NDT]

Excellent research! Now we know!

 

[msgjd]

What I would like to know is when production of the M416 trailer began, and whether the early production models
had tail lights without turn signals like the WWII～M100 trailers.

early-1960's with or after the introduction of the M151 but I do not know exactly when .. All M416's. I saw in the 1970's-up had twin taillights ... I have an M100 w/single stop/taillamp and am familiar with what you are referring to

 

[MAKOTO MATSUMIYA]

early-1960's with or after the introduction of the M151 but I do not know exactly when .. All M416's. I saw in the 1970's-up had twin taillights ... I have an M100 w/single stop/taillamp and am familiar with what you are referring to

Production of the M151A1, which is equipped with turn signals, began in 1964, so it is surprising that the M416, which has the tail lights compatible with turn signals, was produced before that.
The M416 mentioned by Mr. nealseale in the first post was made in 1962, so I'd like to see a photo.

 

[MAKOTO MATSUMIYA]

They could be Mighty Mite wheels, they are interchangeable bolt pattern and size wise. Mites had magnesium wheels for light weight.
The M416B1 was the specified trailer for the Mite, but I don't know enough about the history of them to say whether they always had magnesium wheels.

Cheers

I also thought that the M422 mighty mite and M416B1 were magnesium wheels, but they were actually steel wheels.

 

[M813rc]

They also initially had magnesium wheels.

Cheers

 

[MAKOTO MATSUMIYA]

They also initially had magnesium wheels.

Cheers

Thanks for your assistance.
Do the magnesium wheels have the same design?

Is the prototype in this video a magnesium wheel?

 

[msgjd]

Production of the M151A1, which is equipped with turn signals, began in 1964, so it is surprising that the M416, which has the tail lights compatible with turn signals, was produced before that.
The M416 mentioned by Mr. nealseale in the first post was made in 1962, so I'd like to see a photo.

If the M151(A0's) did not have directionals, then yes it is plausible the first M416's were lamped like the M100's.. I do not know because in my experience beginning in the 1970's all the Mutts's, old and newer, had directionals. When i was in AIT for heavy motor transport, all three M151 versions were in the motor pool and we were taught the specific differences between them. The "A0's" in AIT had bullet directionals and split windshields same as the A1's. The only way we could tell the difference between the A0 and A1 (other than the nomenclature tag) was to get under and look at the suspension.. The A2 was easy to spot at a distance, of course.

We had to spend an entire week on the Mutt before moving on to the big stuff, which was self-pace.. The trainers seemed more concerned with us learning the dangers and handling differences between the three M151 models than whether or not we could handle M35's, M52's and M123's

In my military world i had never seen a M151"A0" without directionals, nor their M416 trailer without.. I cannot say with any certainty whether or not they had directionals when they first came out

 

[MAKOTO MATSUMIYA]

If the M151(A0's) did not have directionals, then yes it is plausible the first M416's were lamped like the M100's.. I do not know because in my experience beginning in the 1970's all the Mutts's, old and newer, had directionals. When i was in AIT for heavy motor transport, all three M151 versions were in the motor pool and we were taught the specific differences between them. The "A0's" in AIT had bullet directionals and split windshields same as the A1's. The only way we could tell the difference between the A0 and A1 (other than the nomenclature tag) was to get under and look at the suspension.. The A2 was easy to spot at a distance, of course.

We had to spend an entire week on the Mutt before moving on to the big stuff, which was self-pace.. The trainers seemed more concerned with us learning the dangers and handling differences between the three M151 models than whether or not we could handle M35's, M52's and M123's

In my military world i had never seen a M151"A0" without directionals, nor their M416 trailer without.. I cannot say with any certainty whether or not they had directionals when they first came out

Your account of your time in the military is very interesting and informative.
Neither the 1962 M151 nor the 1962 M422 in the photos have turn signals.



However, this photo was taken in Germany in 1962 and shows an M151, probably from 1960 or 1961, with turn signals added.


This photo also appears to have been taken in Germany in 1974, and this M151A2 has side markers attached.
I'm not sure if it was a safety regulation issue in Europe, but were turn signals required?
The early M151s with turn signals that you saw when you were at AIT were probably fitted with them later.

I have never seen a case where turn signals were added to a vehicle of the US military in Japan after the fact,
but I wonder what the situation was in the US?

 

[Guyfang]

This picture was taken in Garmisch Germany. The reason I know this, is that I was there this week, 5-8 October. The mountains in the background, were what I looked at every morning when I woke up at the Edelweiss Hotel! This picture was taken in what was called Sheridan Kaserne. Today it houses the George C. Marshall Center for Security Studies.

 

[MAKOTO MATSUMIYA]

Guyfang :
What a coincidence!
You are from Germany.
I've never seen it myself, but I've heard that there is a company in Germany that buys and restores surplus M151 vehicles from all over Europe.

 

[Guyfang]

I live in Germany. But am a retired American soldier, living here.

Yes there is a company here that restores Trucks. They have a TV show. I cant remember the name of it, but will when my burned out old brain gets around it.

 

[msgjd]

The early M151s with turn signals that you saw when you were at AIT were probably fitted with them later.

THANKS for the pics !!! Yes, they were fitted afterwards, without any doubt now ! .. Not just in AIT, but i ran into several "A0's" afterwards with other units as my time progressed, all with directionals , and all were in CONUS.. Probably one of those USDOT things, just like the late-80's-90's retrofitting of side marker lights on the older big trucks