MEP 016d transfer pump

[Jries]

Ive been working on my 16d trying to get it all wired up and tested. Last week I had everything working and just needed to hook up the outlets. This week I hooked up the outlets and the transfer pump doesnt work! My 16d is a bit of a misfit. I only have one float switch and no resistor on the bottom of it.. Ive bench tested the pump and it works. Ive also tested the float and it operates as it should (I flipped the float to keep a higher fuel level in the tank) When I check the voltage from the mag I get nothing but when I run 24v into the leads (acting as the magneto) I get nothing from the output to the float. What do you guys think?

Oh and does anyone have and suggestions for my outlet set up? I made it all as water tight as possible while retaining the original output lugs, I put them in a waterproof box.

 

[cucv1833]

I like that box and setup. I may have to try that with a RV Rec plug.

A little green paint on the box wont hurt

As for the fuel pump im still trying to figure mine out. Have you read through this threads and others?
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/auxiliary-equipment/83674-mep016d-fuel-pump.html

 

[Jries]

After messing with it again this morning I'm pretty sure that my rectifier I bad. I'm getting 44+\- ac from the magneto but nothing from the rectifier. I tried testing it and am getting open line from all leads. Does anyone know why the part number of these are or where you can get one?

 

[ETN550]

I have no idea where to get the rectifier that is on the unit. However, it appears that there is a large variety of suitable ones on E-bay for under $10.00. Just pick one that has 4 legs (full wave with one connector to be ground). That way it can mount anywhere and not have to be grounded itself. The four leads would be Mag/Mag/-Ground/ +DC.

Below is a pic of a typical one I saw. I would not recommend using a regulator rectifer assembly without adding a battery to the system. Just stick with a plain rectifier replacement. Since the Yanmar makes 45 - 50 volts A/C and may have upwards of 10 amps I would choose a rectifer that is rated at least 100 volts and 25 amps for extra beef.



A local electronics supply repair place may have them too.

 

[Jries]

I've messed with the system a little more and now the floats not working either! I have no idea what could have caused everything to fry at once but either way I'm going to modify it. I pulled the dynamo and its looking rough to say the least.

I'm going to dill and tap a pipe plug for the float switch bung and run the pump full time filling the tank from there. I'm going to run a return line from the top of the tank where the pump used to fill from. I'm also going to swap the dynamo and rectifier to 12v and put an onboard battery and starter. I'm also going to have to swap out the facet 24v pump for a smaller 12v pump. I'm thinking that a setup like this will eliminate some of the downfalls of the current fuel systems and gen sets. The only issue that I'm having is how to run the return line into the belly tank. I can't get inside of it for a bulkhead fitting. Any suggestions? Does anyone see any flaws with my plan?

 

[ETN550]

I've messed with the system a little more and now the floats not working either! I have no idea what could have caused everything to fry at once but either way I'm going to modify it. I pulled the dynamo and its looking rough to say the least.

I'm going to dill and tap a pipe plug for the float switch bung and run the pump full time filling the tank from there. I'm going to run a return line from the top of the tank where the pump used to fill from. I'm also going to swap the dynamo and rectifier to 12v and put an onboard battery and starter. I'm also going to have to swap out the facet 24v pump for a smaller 12v pump. I'm thinking that a setup like this will eliminate some of the downfalls of the current fuel systems and gen sets. The only issue that I'm having is how to run the return line into the belly tank. I can't get inside of it for a bulkhead fitting. Any suggestions? Does anyone see any flaws with my plan?

Excellent choices, in my opinion. Check my thread on the home made generator. I made a simple saddle fitting that clamped on the filler neck of the belly tank to create a return connection. In addition to what you propose I would also add a switch to turn off the fuel pump. Since your engine mounted tank will be maintained at near full being able to switch off the fuel pump will allow you to use the last part of the fuel in the engine mounted tank once the belly tank is empty. In addition, in case parts of the belly tank or electric system or pump failed the unit can be run off the engine mounted tank alone.

As an alternate to bringing fuel in the bottom it could be brought in via the injector return line and fitting. That way if you did run off the engine tank alone and turned off the pump fuel could not siphon out of the engine tank. although those lines are small they are way more than enough to supply fuel.

Ebay has a ton of rectifer / regulators to take the mag output and make regulated 12vdc to maintain the battery and run the pump.

To be sure that the new 12vdc pump does not pump more than the gravity can return to the belly tank I suggest installing an in line needle valve to make the output from the pump a strong dribble.

Please post up progress and results. These are most needed mods to benefit the 016D.

 

[Jries]

Etn550,
Thanks for the suggestions. I will check out your thread. I had no idea about being able to regulate down the 50 vac to 12. That'd save some money

 

[Jries]

Stupid question but how do you feel about using the belly tank drain bung for the overflow return from the head tank? If I use a small pump and restrict the flow do you hunk it'd work or too much restriction? I also thought about using a bulkhead fitting in the cap for the belly tank

 

[ETN550]

Small pump with a restriction would work fine. I used a brass needle valve with 1/8 pipe threads from an ACE Hardware store on mine. It just dribbles. The engine uses a tiny amount of fuel by comparison.

I think the belly tank bung could be used. A tee could be added to keep the drain feature.

I will say this, however. Every system that I have seen from the factory that moves fuel or transfers it always drops the fuel in the receiving tank above the level. I'm not sure why because it still gets some air in it as it drops in. Just saying that is what I have seen.

The bung is far from the pickup any way and the top tank will sort the air out. I would try it because it is easy to do and it can always be put back if needed.

On another subject. When the float hole is plugged a brass plug could be drilled out and a steel tube soldered in that would extend up into the tank establishing the fuel level wherever you like it. Set it just above the drain port chosen. Or even easier a reducer bushing could be screwed in the tank and then a tube type compression fitting with a pipe thread that matches the reducer bushing used to set the tube in the tank at a precise height. Choose a tube size that a hose fits over snug and use a hose clamp and done. Can the existing float be gutted to become the delivery tube? Just some ideas.

As I have thought about the design a little more the last day or so, I think a tube sticking up in the top tank above the return outlet is the way to go. With that setup no matter what happens with the pump the fuel cannot siphon backwards out of the top tank, which make the generator fully operable on just the top tank alone if needed.

Sounds like a fun project.

 

[Munchies]

How about the filler neck for a return?

 

[ETN550]

Yes, that's what I used on my project.

 

[Jries]

I'd like to use the filler for the return but am having a hard time trying to tap into it. Can't use a bulkhead fitting due to it being curved and I'd rather steer clear of a plastic saddle. Also I found out that my belly tank is stainless which makes brazing difficult.

 

[ETN550]

I'd like to use the filler for the return but am having a hard time trying to tap into it. Can't use a bulkhead fitting due to it being curved and I'd rather steer clear of a plastic saddle. Also I found out that my belly tank is stainless which makes brazing difficult.

That explains why those metal tanks are always so spotless! Good 'ol stainless steel.

If you cannot make a metal saddle right away why not try the tank bung for the return? It's just hoses and fittings. Easily undone if you change later.

If you find the 1-3/4 exhaust tube then just fit a nipple or coupling to it and find someone to weld it for you. Then after it is welded drill it out. It will make a good saddle for the filler neck. I used a 1/8 pipe nipple and sawed off the end that welds to the saddle. I did not curve the cut end to match the saddle. It's so slight it does not matter welded up fine. Ask someone at a garage or auto parts store if you don't weld yourself. there are lots of people around that have a small machine to do that.

If you used a coupling which is bigger in diameter I think brazing would hold ok. as long as the saddle is steel it will braze or weld okay.

 

[Jries]

So I messed around with it for a bit today. I tried drilling and tapping a plumbing pipe hanger to use as a saddle, would have worked but I only had a 1/4" pipe tap which was too big and it blew through the side of the socket. Then I got to thinking. If I drill out the rivet in the center of the fuel cap and use a bulkhead fitting, the backing nut and washer will hold the gasket, it should work just fine. The parts are being ordered.

I also decided on gutting the float switch and using the tube and plug as the return. It sets a high fuel level which ETN550 has suggested, Thanks by the way, and its a perfect fit. I cut then end drilled out the internals chissled away the epoxy on the bottom and tapped it. Works amazing! The larger diameter makes more sense since as the return rather then fill since it will be gravity fed meaning that the pump doesnt have to be restricted and can run all out reducing stress on it and hopefully prolonging its life.

As for the belly tank. They, mine anyway, are stainless with a brass weld on cap. This is common on street rods, planes, ect I just figured the Govt would make it from all one material. The good news is it opens another option of brazing in a bung if it comes down to it.

Ill post pics soon of the float. The rest will take a bit

 

[Jries]

Oh and by the way. If you gut your float dont try to unsolder the end cap the internals are filled with some nasty epoxy that stinks to high heaven.

 

[Jries]

Return tube/old sending unit

 

[ETN550]

Looks good. You are probably going to have to pinch down the flow from the pump to the tank. The gravity return line will only flow so fast. I soldered a plug into a fitting and drilled a 1/16" hole in it. It still folwed a lot so I added a needle valve from the hardware store which gives adjustability.

Keep us posted on how it is working.

 

[Jries]

I'm going to see if the 24v pump will run on 12(half speed/flow). If not ill replace it with a smaller flow 12 v pump and regulator. I also changed my mind on the return. I drilled and taped a 1 1/2" split clamp pipe hanger and brazen a nipple in. It fits around my filler neck perfectly and with a gasket should be fuel tight. The nipple also sticks out from the backside a little so that it goes inside the neck to prevent leaks. When I get home next week ill assemble and test it!

 

[Jries]

Changed my mind about the return line again. Check out the pics! I also added a cord rack to the front. I threaded some aluminum rod and bent it to make hooks similar to the ones used on welders.

 

[Jries]

I can only upload one pic