Need some guidance after a major wiring meltdown

[MarcusOReallyus]

First, thanks for continuing to let people know how this is turning out - sometimes people get the fixes they need and don't let people know what worked, so it makes it harder for the next reader to figure out what they should do.

Amen to that!


And in addition to what Tim said about your gremlin, I'd say have a look at your hazard switch. Since the turn signals work at the actual turn lights, your grounds are probably okay there... Dash grounds might be an issue.

 

[tim292stro]

Thanks, it was stupid simple. I have one loose copper leaf on the socket for the cluster, it had folded over and touched the one next to it. 100% now. I can finally drive it again. I have a new hood for it at work so that will be the next project.

Beautiful! Congrats on getting it street-able again!!

 

[Rvitko]

Here are some pics, proud of the new wheel well. I actually bit off more than I wanted with that. When I looked at it, I assumed the reinforcement brackets were just held on by the tray bolts, I had to drill out the spot welds and weld them on the new wheel well which was from JC Whitney. It actually was a bit of a project, I had to helicoil a couple of the nuts that hold the battery retainers on and do some thorough rust removal but it is nice to have it right.

 

[usabamaman]

I am glad everything is working out and it looks good too, and thanks for sharing this valuable information. I am like the others above worrying about the day I will have similar problems and where I might be at the time of the "disaster". I am wondering if there is a way to prevent further damage once something goes wrong. For instance, would it be possible to install a normally on relay for each positive cables for the two batteries and somehow run a fusible link to it that would melt breaking the circuit before anything else could melt?

 

[Rvitko]

I researched that backwards and forwards, I asked at the starter/alternator shop for ideas (they made my cables and sold me the batteries) and read everything I could find here. I have to agree with Doghead on this, their is a practical limit to what you can do. We can rule out a circuit breaker to the starter as the guys at the alt/starter shop explained that is not constant, the starter may only need a couple hundred amps with the engine warm, it may need 700 or more when it is cold. A fuse is also not an option for that kind of current load. What I could have done here is changed my batteries before I got to this point. The batteries were old, they passed a load test in Dec 2015, one had a 2009 date the other 2010, I didn't want to change them until everything else was done. Past experience is that letting batteries sit is a sure way to kill them and I have moments where the truck is parked for a few weeks at a time while I repair something. I also thought of adding a cut off switch to the starter hot lead, this gets really complicated, if that switch were to short to ground it would be a bad scene and kill switches for that kind of load are already pretty massive, encase it in a box or pipe to isolate everything and it gets really big, hard to mount where it is useful, etc. Using one in the ground is not an option since the truck has a 12v and 24V side and will back feed through the 12V ground if you cut the 24 and really fry some stuff. Do the Doghead mod (especially if you are using the 28MT which the Delco fact sheet I posted on another thread shows it requires a much stronger relay) take care of your batteries and wiring, replace any missing boots on terminals for the alts and other things that could get you, clean the fuse box, do the practical things. My solution to reducing this risk is I want to install a 24V solar panel system on the roof, I want something around 40W, the solargizer is too wimpy for what I want. I am looking for something that if the batteries were dead, 5-6hrs in the sun could get me up and running.

 

[usabamaman]

Cat Batteries

I am planning to do the the Dog Head relay soon. I have almost new batteries, I bought a match set of Caterpillar batteries. They had the best warranty and are supposed to be very vibration resistant. I will also go thru all the connections and make sure they are clean and tight. Let me know if you find any improvements that help including a storage charging system. Thanks again for your posting.

 

[Rvitko]

Just don't let them run down, the guys at the starter/alternator shop knew exactly what happened as it is common to 24V starters, once the voltage drops, the starter draws more amps and arc welds the contact plate in the solenoid, I opened the solenoid and confirmed that was exactly what happened, the plate was purple/blue and stuck to the contact point. They advised changing to 12V as the best prevention, but I already have too much invested in 24V and that was one of the main selling points for me. I would have bought a Civvy model if I wanted 12V. When I was in high school one of my best friends drove a J code civvy model 6.2 K5 Blazer, it was an 84 I believe. We used to hunt rabbits with it, once we rolled it in a field and we flipped it back over and it just kept on going. I wanted one ever since and the 24V gives so many possibilities, I got a bad ass impact wrench off of eBay with the Nato plug connector to assemble blinds, feeders, etc, I also have my eyes on a electric heater for the cab for instant heat in the winter that is for big rigs.

 

[usabamaman]

I too am impressed with the starting power of the 24 volts. I am hoping to keep it. I also am looking into the possibility of adding a 120 volt 5000 BTU window air conditioning unit via an inverter. I think this may be easier than trying to move and change so many things under the hood to add the stock type a.c. that really doesn't work that well anyway. It has the potential to be much cheaper and will plug in at full hook-up campgrounds. And the inverter with this much current could be used to power many things.

 

[Rvitko]

Take a look at the nostalgic air kit, they make one for the Cucv. Before this happened I had started my install. It is about 1k and they will work with you. For instance I wanted to save my blackout lights and voltmeter so they changed my kit with some under dash vents. It is 15k btu. I looked at other options and a truck this size needs 15-20k btu. The only real other option I found was the red dot systems they use on hummers but they cost a lot more and mount on the roof.

 

[usabamaman]

I will take a look at that nostalgic air kit. I would never imagine this vehicle needing 15 to 20 btu's, but it is a large area inside and all that glass too. I plan to build lexan or plexiglass sliding door type separator to divide the back section. This will make the air conditioned section much smaller and help keep the back noises out of the cab. A roof unit would never work here off road with all the tree limbs.

 

[tim292stro]

Surface area, color, glass, lack of insulation, and AIR INFILTRATION all cause AC requirements to skyrocket. I believe most SUVs of modern variety use 2-ton AC systems (24,000btu/hr). Use Lexan if you're using plastic plexiglass shatters into very sharp pieces if broken (think crash). Lexan/Makrolon are used in transparent armor, and prison windows (and prisoner partitions in patrol vehicles).

 

[usabamaman]

That is a good point. I will use the lexan. Increasing safety is another one of my goals for this vehicle, probably the most difficult to achieve or most expensive.

 

[MarcusOReallyus]

Past experience is that letting batteries sit is a sure way to kill them

Yep. Get one of these.

My solution to reducing this risk is I want to install a 24V solar panel system on the roof, I want something around 40W, the solargizer is too wimpy for what I want. I am looking for something that if the batteries were dead, 5-6hrs in the sun could get me up and running.

If you want to cook your batteries to death, that's as good a way as any.

 

[Rvitko]

If you want to cook your batteries to death, that's as good a way as any.

You think so? Even with a good charge controller that would cut the feed when the batteries are at capacity?

 

[tim292stro]

I don't think that 5-6 hours is realistic for a CUCV start. A 40Watt panel under ideal/optimal conditions is only going to squeeze out 1.4Amps. Charging a lead acid battery is at best a 80% efficient. A single Group 31 or 6TL is going to be a >6,000 minute recharge with a 40Watt panel. With ideal conditions you're looking at only about 6 hours of "full sunlight" which would take you the better part of 17-1/2 days to recharge a flat battery. You're better off charging an ultra-capacitor bank with an alternator and using a solar panel that small to keep it topped off (over come leakage current in the capacitors).

3-4 hours is how long it takes a 60 Amp alternator to fully recharge a low battery on a car...

I think what Marcus-O-Reallyus is talking about is using an unregulated float charge? Either that or the Odyssey/Hawker guidance of a minimum charge current - you can actually do damage to an AGM by charging it with too little current. I'm not 100% on the chemistry but it sounds like you can harden an outer layer of the electrodes against accepting a deep charge if the current is too low. It's what you would call a surface charge: voltage looks good but there's no amperage behind it to make power (volts x amps = watts).

 

[MarcusOReallyus]

You think so? Even with a good charge controller that would cut the feed when the batteries are at capacity?

That would do it. I guess I assumed the idea is to just hook up the solar chargers directly. Come to think of it, that was a dumb assumption to make!


But 40 watts is going to take up some decent hood space. Unless you need the portability, I'd just hard-wire one of the battery maintainers and plug it in when it's sitting.

 

[Rvitko]

I was planning on using a system for yachts, the panels are about 30" by 24" (x2) and include a fairly professional controller, it seems 24V solar panels at peak output put out about 32V, the controller keeps it to 24V and monitors the battery temperature and charge, it seems to be pricing out around $350 as a set. I was going to mount it on the fiberglass top, it is light and I can feed the cables through the antenna grommet to the rear buss bars. I like the idea of it being "off the grid" and out of mind, I don't have to remember to do anything, if it is in sun, it's good. I also figure the 1.4 Amps will be a reasonably good charge as my new batteries showed 50% on my charge and I brought them up using 2Amp charging and it took about 5 hours to reach 100%, if they were completely dead it might not work so well, but I think at 30-50% 5-6 hours would be a decent charge.