New Soy Oil as fuel

[Polverone]

Would using Veggie Oil,

A) Alter or destroy any rubber seals in the diesel system?

B) Destroy the F.I.P?

C) Leave a sticky residue in the fuel tank/pipes etc

D) Does it burn off cleanly, or would it carbon up the head and foul the injector nozzels?

M35A2 has some good questions and I thought I would bring this thread over here and ask a question of my own.

I was in COSTCO yesterday and checked the 5 gal. containers of Soy and Vegetable Oil. Brand new Soy Oil is $14 and change (no tax as it is a food item).

So, most of the threads deal with Biodiesel being converted after it has been used a fry oil.
Can this be used without cracking it with Methanol/lye or does it still have the glycerin in it and need the process done?

Also temperature could be a factor but:
When it gets to Memmorial Weekend around here in California, they jack the fuel rates to the moon, (have to use all the MTBE and other additives for smog BS), for the rest of the summer. That's when it is nice and hot here- aka Soy Oil time??

Please tell me I am filling up at COSTCO.

 

[Recovry4x4]

Gary, thats still $2.80 a gallon. Is that much of a break over regular diesel prices?

 

[Polverone]

Right now diesel is hovering at $2.99 a gal. and some places (Malibu) it is already over $3.00. I bet it wil be $3.25 before summer hits

 

[Katch1]

cranetruck where are you?

 

[Dieselsmoke]

Gary, my buddy has been running Cosco's soy oil in his '95 Dodge Cummins for quite some time now. Just dumps it in and goes, man does it make you want a hamburger though, smells soo good LOL He also runs used ATF in his other truck, simply filters it and goes. No problems so far and the trucks both dyno in the neighborhood of 450-500 HP.

 

[gringeltaube]

Soy bean oil as fuel

I'm still running on pure sunflower oil, preheated. Next week I'll be testing fresh soy bean oil which costs about half as much as diesel.

Gerhard

 

[cranetruck]

Gary, the cubies are actually 35 lb or 4.77 gallons for exact pricing ($2.94/gal).
Yes, you can run on this fuel for sure, but limit it to about 20% or so if you don't have a dual/heated fuel tank system.
Starting/stopping on too much veggie oil will cause coking of the injectors.
The reason for heating and/or converting the veggie oil to biodiesel is to reduce the viscosity.
There is a lot more on this in other threads. Do a search.
(A chart showing the relative viscosities below)
RME stands for Rapeseed Methyl Ester, biodiesel made from rapeseed (canola) oil.

 

[Polverone]

Thanks for the chart, Bjorn. That really gives a visual as to viscosity values.
I'll get a couple of jugs of the stuff and "perfume" my diesel exhaust for when I get around to making a long trip.

 

[ken]

I'vw thought about this a few times. Since the mutli can handle thicker fuels, why can't we run straight veg oil. With out heating. Bjorn, How many engine hours do you think we could go before the injectors start to clog? Do you think a injector cleaner mixed in would help?

 

[cranetruck]

Ken, don't know about the time until the injectors start to coke up.
Coking here means that carbon builds up from unburned fuel (=poor atomization).
Without heating, you couldn't start the thing unless you live in Texas or Florida, I guess , which brings me to a standing question I have about the fuel temp when the tank is exposed to the hot Southern sun.
Straight used veggie oil is like apple sauce when it gets down to 35-40F. No way the fliters could handle that. The IP has certain minimum specs for viscocity, but I don't know what the are. We should find out.

 

[ken]

It's not uncommon to have a low of 80deg F in the summer here. It's also not hard to break 100 daily. Although duece driving at that temp almost takes the fun out of it. I agree coking=fouling. But i still think it would be best to mix in at least some diesel. Fouling injectors is a constant worry for me. I use probally too much used motor oil as fuel. I haven't pulled the injectors yet to see. I use power service injector cleaner and cetane booster in the gray bottle. Hopefully it will help keep them clean.
I thought i read in a TM that these engines could handle %71 crude oil? But for how long?

 

[wallew]

Bjorn,
IF all we are trying to do is to lower viscosity, then why would the lye/methanol be the ONLY way to go?

I'm still considering running some form of veggie oil mixed with either/or/and Naptha/Acetone.

I currently run acetone as an additive in regular diesel. Having said that, I figure that if you just break it down with an extra couple of gallons of Naptha or Acetone or even straight methanol (ethyl methyl ketone?).

It just seems that using almost ANY other petroleum product would drop the viscosity. For example, I don't know the current cost of either new/used motor oil or new/used hydraulic fluid but it seems that especially tranny fluid (hydraulic fluid) has a LOT of cleaners built in. So there would be zero coking in the injectors.

And that says NOTHING of just adding one or two gallons of gasoline for every fill up. So it seems to me that would also lower viscosity.

When petroleum products like gasoline and diesel WILL EXCEED $3.50 a gallon this summer all across the country, it will be interesting if the costs of veg oil follows suit.

jim

 

[cranetruck]

Those additives may lower the viscosity, BUT what do they do to the combustion process? I started another thread with hours and hours of reading material. That information should clear up some questions.
The most basic question has to be "How long can you use it?" ("It" being the kind of fuel mixture in question).

 

[G744]

The multifuel wasn't designed to use thicker fuels than a regular Diesel, rather thinner. Like gasoline.

Jet "A", JP-8, CIE, all close to Diesel in viscosity.

Straight Mazola runs fine out here in the summer.

Ummm. tasty!

dg

 

[DrFoster]

We've found guys here that own chow-halls and they will GIVE us the oil because normally they pay to have it hauled off. From my little test, it can be used during the summer with little additives at all. If you're in socal, you may be able to get away with it year round on a 30-50% diesel mix.

 

[cranetruck]

Again, short term may be okay. Check the pH of the used cooking oil and you'll find that it's acidic. Don't know if the additives will neutralize it. In the long run the acidic fuel will eat some metal if it isn't stainless.

Converting it into biodiesel produces a neutral fuel and just warming it a little (my system, ) will make it possible to use it all year in any climate.
More work? Maybe, but I think it's worth it.