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Newbie questions regarding brake work

Jeeper10

Member
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0
5
Location
Freeville NY
I hate starting out being brand-new into a site was so many questions but I'm hoping to get some advice from the experts. I'm considering buying my first deuce (M35A2) and as probably many of us are I truly am on a very strict budget. I can afford to buy the deuce but I'm getting stomachaches worried about whether or not I can afford to put on the road and get it to pass inspection. There is dampness behind all the brakes and upon further inspection I believe at least a couple of them have leaking brake parts ie wheel cylinders or lines. Both fronts have bad boots which isn't so awful from what I've read. The parts seems easy enough to get and they look pretty much like normal automobile parts just much bigger. My question is is it inrealistic to assume that I could do this work myself using normal handtoolsl? If not what would I need? I have a standard shop jack which may not be enough. I know I would need to get some really heavy duty jackstands. I do have a 15 ton bottle jack but I'm not sure I could make that stable enough. I do not have access to a large enough garage, or barn. So it would be very much be a backyard job. None of the lights seem to work on either but that's work I'm confident I can do. The outer driver side rear axle hub also seems to be leaking onto the outside of the wheel which I assume is axle grease perhaps? Any advise would be greatly appreciated and sorry for all the newbie questions. I want one of these in the worst way but don't want to get instantly over my head mechanically or financially LOL. Again sorry for all the ridiculous questions and I do a greatly appreciate it.
 

theeDIZ

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You have to remember that most of these haven't been rebuilt in 20-30 years so it's a good idea to look into the axles and brakes ! That being said the parts are readily available and doing the work is up to your comfort level working on trucks of this size. I've done all the work to my deuce in a parking lot . The wiring in these are pretty simple to.
 

wreckerman893

Possum Connoisseur
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All hobby vehicles require maintenance and the funding to do that maintenance.

If you can only afford the truck but not the parts to keep it in safe operation you might want to consider waiting a while.

You are also going to have to consider insurance, tags and where to keep it if your local zoning laws won't allow you to keep it at your house.

It is easy to get into a money pit if you are not careful.

I just waved goodbye to my last deuce (M275 tractor) because I needed the money for other projects and didn't want it to deteriorate any more.

I'm not saying don't pull the trigger but go into it with eyes wide open.

These vehicles will always be available.
 

Jeeper10

Member
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Location
Freeville NY
Thank you. I can afford the maintenance in it if I am able to do the work myself but much less so if I have to pay to have it all done. I stopped at a local Diesel repair shop and they gave me a worse case scenario estimate of more than 2k for a full brake job. The that would be difficult to swallow. I'm taking my time and trying to do my homework before I dive in. Thanks again ��
 

frank8003

In Memorial
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You are not in quandary as you have not spent time nor money........yet
How about go help someone that already is working on a truck like you want within your area.
Don't do it like Frank did and be a newbie earning a Deuce apprenticeship.
Many self-taught lessons learned, just so I felt safe enough to take it on the road.
Goto
http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?98548-Member-Map
..........and ask around.
You would be hard pressed to find a better group of people outside of the Steel Soldiers site.
and post pictures.
 

Attachments

18operator

Well-known member
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Seville, Ohio
Doing the regular maintenance work on a deuce isn't all that much different, just on a little bit bigger scale. Downloading the Deuce TM's is a really good start. And searching the older threads helped me out a lot.

There are a few specialty tools you need, but they should be available at your local NAPA or truck parts dealer. 3 inch 8 point socket for the hubs comes to mind.
Get yourself a set of six ton jack stands also. The 15 ton bottle jack will lift the part of the truck you want to work on.
If you are half way mechanically inclined you shouldn't have a problem with what you're trying to do.
 

m16ty

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Buy some 8' 6x6 post from the lumber yard and cut them up in two foot sections. Use them as cribbing to hold the truck up. Cheaper than heavy jack stands and safer if you aren't working on a hard, flat surface. Oak would be better but the treated pine you get at the lumber yard will hold a deuce up fine.
 

Shirehorse

Member
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Location
Mantua, OH
I could not imagine being not mechanically inclined and owning one of these trucks.

Parts are FAIRLY reasonable, but as with anything, labor is the killer. Being my own mechanic, the only thing I'm out is time.

Frank said it best, you're not YET in a quandary, as you have not yet drained your bank account in a purchase. The best way to make sure you start off in the green is to plan for the worst, and celebrate when the best happens. Here's an example of the truck I'm working on now.

A very good friend of mine got a good deal on a deuce that had been part of a large collection when the owner died. Now, this job started off as a prep and paint, but as we were going over the specifics of what he wanted, it was brought to my attention that his brakes were not working very well at all. I told him, at that time, that we could do the brakes without much effort, but we'd have to repack bearings and do seals while I had them off, just so that he wasn't getting a half job. He got the truck for an excellent price, so we weren't too worried about what we'd find.

Needless to say, its neglect started to show when we got down into it. And, fortunately, he was in a position where he could put the money into it for the repairs that it needed. You may want to really sit down and write out what exactly you want to do to it, what modifications you want to make, as well as the cost of routine services that you are going to perform. IF it was my truck, I'd treat them as a big unknown unless I personally knew the seller and knew the history of the vehicle. Brakes are always treated as an unknown for me, regardless. Hydraulic brakes are very safe, and very effective when they're in proper working order, and you can more efficiently spot leaks when you know the system is up to your standards.

deuce1.jpg

Here's a few pictures of what we have dealt with:

coolant sludge.jpg
Sludgy coolant system. A coolant filter should definitely be on your list of modifications. The coolant that was in the truck was only protecting down to 31 degrees F when I ran my test strips in it...

DirtyWC.jpg

The wheel cylinders all looked like this, and the rubber on the ends was virtually gone. There was evidence of scratching inside the wheel cylinders themselves, indicating dirt in the system. In this case, you can see the evidence in the brake drum where there was DOT5 Brake fluid pooling while the truck sat. The pictures below are of the compromised wheel cylinder.

leakingWCP.jpgleakingWC.jpgleaking WC2.jpg

Let's not forget the brake hoses. This is one of the better ones.

hose.jpg

This is the inside of the primary Fuel filter housing. I'd say that this was pretty extreme, but I have not worked on many deuces, so I cannot make that dissertation.

primaryfil housing.jpgprimfildirt.jpg

Last but not least, this is a view of one of the tires. Out of the ten tires that were on the truck, only two were (in my opinion) safe to operate. Note in the last picture, there was nothing on the outward facing side of the tire to indicate that it was in this condition. It should also be noted that this tire was on the steer axle.

Trashtire.jpgtrashtire2.jpgtire1.jpg


Sorry if this came off long winded, that was not my intention. I do better with pictures than with text, by far. I wanted to share this with you as an example of some things to look for upon your next inspection of the truck.

Don't let this dissuade you, however. Between the TMs and this website, you can do anything that you set your mind to with these trucks. For the most part, a standard wrench set, a 3/4 inch breaker bar and socket set, and a good bottle jack/stands, and a little brute force will get you just about everything you need done on these things.

But, that being said, PLAN ACCORDINGLY.

Also keep in mind, I'm not an expert. I can't hold a candle to the knowledge that the long-time members of this site hold.

~Brian
 
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Jeeper10

Member
97
0
5
Location
Freeville NY
I didn't pull the trigger on the deuce, I feel like I'm probably missing out on a pretty good deal but I really want to gain more knowledge before I take the plunge. I'm very grateful for everybody's advice on here and will continue to watch and learn and hopefully find the right one for me at a price I can afford
 

AZK9

Active member
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Location
PRC, AZ
...


View attachment 602825
I do better with pictures than with text, by far. I wanted to share this with you as an example of some things to look for upon your next inspection of the truck.

Don't let this dissuade you, however. Between the TMs and this website, you can do anything that you set your mind to with these trucks. For the most part, a standard wrench set, a 3/4 inch breaker bar and socket set, and a good bottle jack/stands, and a little brute force will get you just about everything you need done on these things. ... ~Brian
Brian... I for one would like you to know (IMHO) that the kind of post that you made is very helpful and positive... especially for new
folks considering getting into MV ownership. Your words were cautionary, but realistic. Your choice of photos was clear and very
relevant to the topic.

I can look back, a short time, over my own experience and can relate very much to what you thoughtfully communicated to this thread.

Well done! [thumbzup] Much appreciated!
 

AZK9

Active member
1,083
6
38
Location
PRC, AZ
I didn't pull the trigger on the deuce, I feel like I'm probably missing out on a pretty good deal but I really want to gain more knowledge before I take the plunge. I'm very grateful for everybody's advice on here and will continue to watch and learn and hopefully find the right one for me at a price I can afford
Wondering if you've been able to make that short drive we had discussed? :wink:
 

TB58

Member
289
2
18
Location
Fayetteville, Nc
I would agree that these trucks are fairly simple mechanically(other than the wheel seals that are still kicking my butt). On the flip side of that is everything is very large and heavy which adds a degree of difficulty all its own. These trucks spent a lot of their almost 50 years just sitting. This means that things are pitted and dry rotted and will require in-depth inspections. I really enjoy working on the truck and learning more and more about it, but it does take up the majority of my off time and gets frustrating at times. If the truck isn't a required vehicle would be ideal, this way you aren't stressing when a project runs into problems and takes longer than expected. It will also allow you to schedule maintenance when the budget will allow.
 

Shirehorse

Member
168
21
18
Location
Mantua, OH
I would agree that these trucks are fairly simple mechanically(other than the wheel seals that are still kicking my butt).
If you're talking about the seal that you tap on the spindle on the M35A2, I use a plastic handle (like the one off a gas station like squeegie you buy at autozone) and tap it on lightly with a hammer. It's soft enough not to mar, pit, or bend the metal mating surfaces.

If you're talking about the hub seal on a 5 ton, I've got tricks for that too.

-Brian
 

AZK9

Active member
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38
Location
PRC, AZ
I would agree that these trucks are fairly simple mechanically(other than the wheel seals that are still kicking my butt). ..
Hope that you'll soon make some significant progress getting ahead of your 'wheel seal' troubles. [thumbzup]

I know that you've experienced a lot with your MV and overcome some pretty bad situations... especially those
tough, pressure situations you had to deal with while traveling. Not fun stuff at the time, but just think of all the
knowledge and mechanical experience you gained! Yup... it's all big, heavy and mostly old, but you seem to be
steadily gaining a working understanding of it all. I'm trying to do the same in my situation with my deuce thanks
to folks such as yourself.

I continue to learn from you and others... especially from the problems and frustrations that are posted during
those times of 'frustration'. You somehow overcame the worst during your adventure from Alaska. I've got to
assume that you had to have learned a ton of stuff about your truck that you were not necessarily familiar with
when you first began that awesome road trip.

When I head out from the east coast with Arizona as my target destination... I hope that the preparation work I've
done to my M35A2 will allow me to drive it 'trouble-free' from beginning to end. Though with Murphy always lurking...
I honestly don't expect things to be so smooth-n-easy. Still, I'm trying to make the most of all that this SS site has to
offer and train myself to expect and hopefully deal with the unexpected. You, your road trip and your frustrations have
taught me a lot so far. :)
 

TB58

Member
289
2
18
Location
Fayetteville, Nc
AZK9 - thank you for the kind words. It is amazing how much you can learn when you are in the middle of no where Canada. Looking back I really should have given myself a lot more time to prep the truck prior to my drive. Going through everything before your drive is the smart way to do it and will cause fewer "learning experiences" on the side of the road.
 

Jeeper10

Member
97
0
5
Location
Freeville NY
Yes, I'm in the process of purchasing that very deuce. I hope it will be in my driveway within the week. I spent some time there today (with h the current owners permission) and managed to get the lights working and the emergency brake functioning. I'm trying to not get ahead of myself and jinks it but here are a couple more pictures. Feel free to tell me anything about it good or bad from the pics.
Hey Dave... You made that post on the 12th. Any good news now that it's the 16th? :-D


BTW... this (see below) is a good TM to get familiar with, just in case you happen to find an old
deuce in your driveway anytime soon! 8)

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/upload/M35/TM9-2320-209-20-2-1.pdf It's a trouble-shooters dream TM! [thumbzup]
 
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