No crank condition

[jerseyjeep2003]

First I did use the search button without any results that would help me with this. I was getting an intermittent no crank condition, several pushes of the starter button and it would fire right up. Yesterday I made a 50 mile trip, the truck sat for a couple of hours, then the same, first push was kind of a sluggish crank then nothing. A couple of button pushes later and it kicked right over. Today, nothing, not a click, nothing but the low air buzzer and power to the gauges. So i took the starter button out and checked continuity, it is good. Then proceeded to remove the solenoid and clean and put dielectric grease on all of the connections, same with the starter and battery terminals. I had just cleaned all of my ground connections a few weeks ago, but checked them anyway, they were still tight and clean. The small wire to the top of the relay had a piss poor wire splice on it, so I also fixed that. Put everything back, hooked up the batteries, which were both reading 12.5 volts and a solid 25 volts combined, and NOTHING, not even power to the main switch. I checked power from the starter positive side to ground and got 25 volts. Any thoughts? Would a bad relay keep me from getting power to the main switch? I don't think I mixed up any wires at the starter so I don't think that would be the issue, but you never know. Maybe if someone has a picture of the starter/solenoid area that would eliminate one possibility.

The kicker of this is, I was a dummy when I parked it, and blocked my car in. I don't think Wheaties and spinach would give me enough muscles to push it out of the way. I guess it is a sick day for me from work today.

 

[73m819]

look at the master solenoid on the right rear of the block, sorta sounds like it is about to die

 

[jerseyjeep2003]

Yeah, I cleaned the connections on that too, but it is pretty rusty looking all over. Would that cause a no power to the main switch condition?

 

[73m819]

try by passing the solenoid

 

[AZDeuce]

How does one go about bypassing the the solenoid? A diagram might be helpful for us (ME) electrically challenged types. Just say'n.......

 

[rickf]

Jumper cable from big wire on one side to big wire on other side.

 

[cranetruck]

This diagram might help...

 

[papercu]

Load test the batteries, batteries can read good with a meter but a load test will tell a different story. Wayne

 

[AZDeuce]

Cool! thanks for the info....my Deuce is having the same problem, now I have something to check and possibly eliminate, as I work my way to the starter.

 

[Heavysteven]

Some photo's

 

[JAYHAWK 1962]

a bad day working on the deuce is usually better than a good day at work

 

[jerseyjeep2003]

I made it into work after all, so i will be using the pics, diagram and jumper cables tomorrow. I think I am headed towards a new relay at the very least.

 

[jerseyjeep2003]

ARRRGGGHH, I thought I had the problem solved, but when I went to leave work an hour ago, no go. I had replaced the starter remote relay, and it seemed to crank and start good. Tonight it gave a half hearted crank, then just click, click. One of my attempts gave a shower of sparks fro somewhere, I couldn't see and my co-workers couldn't pinpoint it for me. We were then going to catch it in gear, but when we started dragging it (main switch on, no button pushing) it started arcing again. I gave up and got a ride home, figuring on trying later during daylight hours. AGAIN any thoughts now?

 

[Loco_Hosa]

Sounds like for that much arc, you have to have a loose connection from battery's to ground, battery's to each other, or battery's to your starting system. Tighten up everything....

 

[rizzo]

what was the problem?

 

[Floridianson]

You could check starter ground to frame rail?

 

[jerseyjeep2003]

It was the starter to frame rail ground. Now a month later I have another issue. Starter occasionally would stay engaged, but today when I turned the power switch on it cranked on it's own, very slowly and noisey. Batteries are fully charged. Guages were randomly going on and off when I drove it yesterday...hmmm weird. My thoughts are with a bad starter....so it is coming out and getting cleaned and tested.

 

[jerseyjeep2003]

I just tried fully charged Optima batteries from my Wrangler. No difference, I didn't think there would be. But, what the heck, it was worth a shot. Here are all the symptoms: 1. starter stays engaged 2. When main power is turned on starter spins on it's own 3. When engaged starter barely cranks motor and sounds like it is dragging something (grinding kind of sound) 4. Gauges erratically power on and off, sometimes they will stay on. 5. Headlights are bright (normal) 6. Tested amp draw at the batteries when trying to crank...100 amps draw from starter with nothing else turned on. 6. When it last ran, at idle power on I had a very "lopey" idle, with power off it had a smooth idle. What I have done: 1. Replaced started relay 2. Replaced broken ground wire from starter to frame 3. Cleaned all connections (terminals and lugs to ground to frame and used dielectric grease 4. repaired several wires that had frayed insulation. I am in the process of removing the starter to clean and check windings. If the starter isn't bad, I am thinking that maybe the generator is going bad, putting a drag on engine..thus creating the lopey idle. Mmaybe by describing the symptoms and tries to fix it, we can solve several guys problems at once. Thanx for the help...I do appreciate all my SS bro's input.

 

[rickf]

Sounds like the starter relay is bad. Look up the "Doghead starter mod". It covers everything you will need.

Here it is.

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/cucv/32943-doghead-starter-relay-modifcation.html

 

[hoop]

I would guess that your armature and or brushes are shot. M50 starter will work. Make sure you get the same tooth count and you may have to clock it.