What do YOU want to know about G-742 history?

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DDoyle

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Greetings all,
After over a decade and a half of work, my G-742 (M34/35/A1/A2/A3 et al) book is now rushing headlong toward completion. This book will be similar to my two-volume Dodge set from a couple years ago.

After having been deeply immersed in this subject so long, I fear that in some cases I may not see the forest for the trees.

So - I ask, what would you like to see in this book? Keep in mind, this is not a how-to or maintenance manual - but a history. (and saying "a photo of MY truck in active military service" won't be meaningful.

While on this seeking of opinion - should I include G-749-series trucks (GMC M135/M211) trucks as well?

Best to respond here, or send an email, rather than PM.

Best wishes,
David Doyle
www.DavidDoyleBooks.com
David@DavidDoyleBooks.com
 

M275Fan

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I for one would love more information on the prototype PIP for the G-742 that produced the 2.5 ton version of the XM-956. If you could get some clear information on that into a single source, I would very much like to read about it. It would also be great to have the book include the M135/M211 family.
 

NDT

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Please expound on the info you published in MVM years ago, i.e. all mfgrs, M numbers, years produced, serial number ranges. Also any theories you have about how gas powered trucks were remanufactured into multifuels and when. Then, in the 80's, the super single retrofit program with the radials prior to the A3s.

Oh and thanks for your tireless efforts with this research. We understand this is a labor of love.
 

gimpyrobb

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Any chance of finding out the original request and how the truck became "the truck"? Did they say "we want a 6x6 cargo" and there were multiple prototypes? There had to be lots of ideas on what they thought would be good till they settled on what we have now. Any R&D of them would be fantastic(imho).
 

cattlerepairman

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I am with gimpy. There was experience with the WWII and M135 series, but the M44 are different in many ways. Why? Why the switch back to a standard transmission? Why a 12ft bed? Then the whole engine story... anything that sheds light on how this was decided!
 

clinto

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Broad topics I'd like to see addressed:

That short 10 year time period, 1945-1955, where the military transitions from the CCKW, they know it's outdated, they want parts interchangeability, they know they want the M-series watrerproof wiring with circuit tags and every truck's #10 circuit does the same thing, etc. In this short 10 year period, they go from the CCKW to the M135/211 trucks and end up with the Reo M44. I'd like to see the "behind-the-scenes" action, GMC lobbying for their truck, the military opinion of the GMCs and how they ended up choosing the M44.

Early in the M44 series, the military seems very fond of it, to the point that they try to make it do everything (wrecker, crane, tanker, tractor, cargo, shop van, etc.). Eventually they begin moving many if not most of those roles to the 5 ton chassis. I'd like to see some history of what they thought they could do, the issues they encountered and how they ended up giving up and moving those roles to the 5 ton chassis.

Much has been written (some by you) about the multifuel's poor showing in VietNam. I'd like to see some internal military discussion about the engine. If they thought it was a bad design or if they chalked it up to a super strenuous work environment and figured it had done about as well as anything else would have. Obviously after VietNam the multifuel continues to serve for almost 30 years.

I'd like to see something about how the M44 series adapted to different conflicts-think about how the F14 transitions from fleet defender to fighter to bomber/reconnaissance as it serves decade after decade and the threats change. Something like what your DUKW book had about DUKWs in Europe and the Pacific.

This is a small part of the story, but is there any military discussion of the stick shift 6x6s and training? I've read that in modern times, less than 10% of incoming Army trainees know how to drive a stick and the military just considers automatics a requirement at this point. So in 2002, is the Army sending out internal memos saying "We've gotta' get rid of these dinosaurs, these stupid kids can't drive them"?

Obviously AM General wanted to continue selling M44 series trucks just like Grumman would have liked to continue selling or upgrading F14s. Everyone knows the story about then-Defense Secretary Dick Cheney ordering the F14 tooling destroyed, thus nearly ensuring Grumman's demise and the demise of the Tomcat and the rise of the Hornet. I want to know that story as it relates to the M44 and it's eventual replacement. Obviously AM General produced the M44A3 in response to the military's modern wishes: automatics, CTIS, power steering, etc. There were several prototypes or concepts (M35E3) with different engines and transmissions, etc. I'd like to read a broad overview of how that transition occurs: AMG knows the M44A2 series is done, the Army wants all this aforementioned stuff, S&S and Oshkosh are producing concepts, everyone wants a piece of this pie and we end up with the MTV series of trucks.

I'd like to read about how the vehicle did in it's operational theaters. VietNam, Panama, Desert Storm, Iraq, etc. Issues, miles driven per labor hour, etc.

Sort of in conjunction with the story about how the M44 was replaced, I'd like to read more about the comparison tests. There was a well known member here on SS who claimed to be a part of the testing and he claimed it was "rigged" in favor of the MTV. He said the test would be set up, they'd do something unorthodox and they'd be remanded "you can't do it that way", leading him to believe the test already had a desired outcome. Sadly, he was killed in a traffic accident, so we can't ask him to produce any stories, documents, etc.

I would love to see production imagery of the assembly lines and how it changed over the years and I'd like to see more info about rebuilding gassers into A1 and A2 models and especially, I'd like to see concrete info about what constituted a refresh, a rebuild, a reset, etc. I'm so sick of these idiots on the internet talking about "MY TRUCK GOT A COMPLETE REBUILD IN 1996 BECAUSE IT HAS A 1996 ENGINE IN IT, DERRRR DERRRRR".

I assume you have pretty concrete info about when the various changes came: sprag to air shift, rear exhaust to stack, box to spring ride, etc., etc?

I am very interested in the 1980s USAF contracts. The USAF ordered all these trucks nearly identical and with some weird requests: wood racks versus fiberglass, pioneer rack and slave ports deleted, practically no winch trucks, all hardtops and of course, dual circuit brakes. Why? What was special about the USAF needs and/or contracts? The story about these "last of the last" M44A2 series trucks really interests me.

Thanks! I'll be the first in line to buy the book when it's available, regardless of the price.
 

Barrman

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Every suggestion I have has been mentioned above. I am sure if it is like your previous books, articles and post on here. Where in one instance you posted the memo about how the REO cab was made to work with the 5 ton trucks, and why.

Details like that, how the gas 2.5 ton and the gas 5 ton were all inter related between the manufactures for example. How the 1953 M35 under cab body work was changed in many ways from the 1952 for another. Are the kind of details we don't know and only seem to come from you.

Thanks for doing this and please post on here once it is published.
 

ReoRider

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Hi David,

All great questions above for your reflection. The 2 1/2 and 5 ton are of amazing significance to so many of us, any information will be really appreciated.

I'm also interested in the quick move from the original single tire configurations in the first releases, as having demonstrated greater mobility in WW11, to the duals for both weight classes. Years then pass before the switch back is again made.

Engine selection is full of questions; early versions had OTR proven motors while the later replacement by the multi line was without an OTR record. What was the thinking beyond getting to a diesel fleet?

Tire design must have been looked at continuously, but again lots of time passed before the switch away from the NDT tread- what were the arguments?

Any of us could go on and on about lines of inquiry, and are happy to leave it to your proven judgement. Remember no such think as too big book for this topic!


Thanks,
John
 

USMC 00-08

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While on this seeking of opinion - should I include G-749-series trucks (GMC M135/M211) trucks as well?
I would love to know more about the G749 series since it seems that there is little info out there about them. Maybe put this info in a book of its own?
 

DavidWymore

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I don't have much, other than to echo what other's have said. Evolution and changeover especially. I've had a lot of fun investigating A1s and other trucks from that transitional era. Looking in paint for evidence of bed U-bolts, fuel tank hangers for exhaust notches, etc. I'm very excited to see the book coming to fruition and can't wait to read it.

I have M35s in my blood, all my good early childhood memories have my dad's in them.

For other members, to whet your appetite or tide you over...there is a gentleman by the last name of Boynton who turned up on the Facebook M35A2 group who was a photographer for Reo may years ago and he posted some interesting pictures of testing and whatnot. I connected him with Mr. Doyle, so I assume those will be showing up in the book.
 

gunboy1656

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I was talking to JAG about how you made it over the last hurdle to get the book made at the National Convention. Glad you are finally getting it made.

I can't wait to see it done

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

m1010plowboy

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We're really enjoying the "human story" that goes along with the G749 trucks. Stories about the men or women who drove them, where they went, first missions, last missions, the Love put in by the individual mechanics who would Rob parts off other trucks to keep them running. Special missions like the recovery of Kosmos 954, the folks that risked their life for that mission, their current health and where those contaminated deuces might be now. Stories of winter driving from Wainwright to Shilo. Deep North adventures of the Early Deuce.

There's a big difference in how Canada utilized the G749 so that's a story on it's own. The M133 and M218 variants that had everything and anything bolted on the back. Some of our boys talk about the huge lines of Deuces set aside for Civil Defence/Emergency Measures Organization that they weren't allowed to touch. How many were stored and where? Our first UN missions to Cyprus, the Brit's using them for training during BATUS in Suffield.

Who drove the deuce, what they did, where they went, when they went there and how Canada used them for so long.

Then there's the after service use of the G749 and G742. The trucks used to pull barges out of Hay Lake, tour boats out of Maligne Lake, the farm life, their duties in the Forestry Service.

Dedicating a small section to the deuces that are still with us doing the parade routes or waiting for the right nut to come along to make them roll.
 

rustystud

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I agree with some here who want to know the back story of the deuce. Who designed it, why some features where added and some not. Who did the testing and are there any pictures of this testing. That sort of thing. I was at Fort Knox when the first M1 Abrams came into service. I was in the Marines at tank school and the new Abrams where stationed next door. The testing was still going on at that time and we would see a couple of tank platoons go out and than later a bunch of tank wreckers would come back with half of them in tow. That was when the turbines where putting out to much power and tearing up the transmissions. So the turbine engines where "detuned" to allow the transmissions to live. I'm sure stuff like that happened with the deuce. That is the kind of information I would love to read about.
 

hendersond

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Agreed with what was said.
Consider expanding the after service history as well. It appears that for some trucks the civil defense, non-government organizations, and local government history far exceeds the military life. How did they get them, what programs, what time periods were they released and so on. I've seen snowplows, HAM radio trucks, wildfire trucks, pumpers, cranes, communications trucks, mobile incident command centers, water tenders and more all on a G749 chassis. It would be cool to see some of that history.
I'll plan to add that book to my collection as well. Thank you
 

m715

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DDoyle if you don't already have a copy of motor transport technical service bulletins published by the war department quartermaster corps 1942 you may want one for reference. I would think a later printing will also have good reference info as well.
 

m1010plowboy

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DDoyle if you don't already have a copy of motor transport technical service bulletins published by the war department quartermaster corps 1942 you may want one for reference. I would think a later printing will also have good reference info as well.
That's a good reference point that I need to follow up on too, thank you. I didn't have any luck with GM Canada. I did get a chance to educate the young GM lad that replied to my inquiry into the G749 built between 1951 and 1956. He stated that GM didn't have any records on trucks built during the second world war.

Poor guy, he did recognize his mistake, we had a discussion about it and he did give me a link to someone that might have those records. When you're ready for that connection DD, I'll pass it on to you.
 

sigo

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More information on all the M44 variants would be interesting. There just isn't much out there about some of the vehicles produced in small quantities; V17A, V18, M756, etc. Development programs, production numbers, photos from the production lines and the field, TO&E requirements, and reports from the field of actual usage.

How about M44 based programs that never went anywhere. I've seen references to various proposals for improvement that seem ahead of their time today, but weren't selected for further development. The XM381 4x4, or some of the later diesel powered trucks that pre-date the A3 come to mind.

Overall, I'd like to see a comprehensive book that has everything we ever wanted to know about M44 trucks. A lot of material that's out there is redundant and only touches basic aspects all geared toward novices. I'd really love to see a "graduate" level book about the history of the deuce.
 

DDoyle

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More information on all the M44 variants would be interesting. There just isn't much out there about some of the vehicles produced in small quantities; V17A, V18, M756, etc.
I think you'll be pleased. If you are familiar with my two-volume Dodge book (http://www.ampersandpubco.com/new-p...deployment-of-dodge-military-trucks-1940-1975) - this project is coming together in much the same fashion, albeit larger, owing to the MANY additional variants and longer production run.

Best,
David
www.DavidDoyleBooks.com
 

clinto

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I'm so excited about this.
 
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