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Building full hydro steering

sewerzuk

Member
524
9
18
Location
Seaside, OR
here is what im doing
Hey, that looks just like mine!
Wait, it IS mine!

IMO, that is a perfectly safe way to mount the orbital; uncomplicated because the shaft bolts right to the valve, safe because all of the pressure lines are outside of the cab and have no direct path to people parts.

I've put a lot of miles on mine since I installed it...no problems at all. I actually take the deuce out more now than I ever did before because it is a pleasure to drive...

You'll be happy you did the mod...worth every penny!
 

jesusgatos

Active member
2,689
28
38
Location
on the road - in CA right now
Just having a hard time understanding why you chose to mount the orbital like that, when it could have easily been mounted on the engine-compartment-side of the firewall. Aside from any potential safety issues, that big hole you hacked out of the firewall just seems kind of unnecessary. Am I missing something?
 

sewerzuk

Member
524
9
18
Location
Seaside, OR
Just having a hard time understanding why you chose to mount the orbital like that, when it could have easily been mounted on the engine-compartment-side of the firewall. Aside from any potential safety issues, that big hole you hacked out of the firewall just seems kind of unnecessary. Am I missing something?
My choice to do this was based on the cost and availability of one-piece steering columns; yes, it is certainly possible to build a longer steering column and mount the steering valve fully inside of the engine compartment. But, it was significantly less expensive, easier, and less complicated to mount it like I did. The hoses are all outside of the cab, so no risk for pinhole leaks causing injury. And, the steering column is all one piece, bolted directly to the steering valve; no additional carrier bearings, u-joints, splined couplers, etc using this method. At least one additional length of column, one u-joint, and a couple of carrier bearings would be necessary to accomplish this. The cost of those little pieces add up quick. It looks funny in the pic, but in person it looks very clean...I split some small diameter fuel line and used it as trim around the cutout, and I was able to use the factory support and rubber bushing to hold the steering column.

edit: The cutout is exactly where the opening for the factory column was; I just enlarged it by an inch or two for the orbital hoses
 
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sewerzuk

Member
524
9
18
Location
Seaside, OR
looks good so far!
Are you planning on putting a filter in your setup?
If you haven't figured out that part yet, I have used magnefine inline magnetic filters on other systems with good success; just search ebay for magnefine and you'll turn up several sizes. It's cheaper than a spin on filter design.
 

ccequipment

Member
387
6
18
Location
Unionville,IN
The PSC can should have a filter in it from NAPA, I am installing a whole new system just like it. They said not to mount the can no further than 16" away with there pump
 

rat3208

New member
9
0
0
Location
npr, fl
I'm new here and just adding for what it's worth. I did full hydraulic steering on a mudder project I built It was as reliable as the day is long but it was very (very) touchy even though the system has a proportional bypass to cut back flow to the rotary valve at higher rpms. I'm definitely not tiring to discourage you just be careful the mudder is the same height but a deuce has alot more mass.
 

Unforgiven

New member
675
17
0
Location
Las Vegas, NV
:ditto:



I've looked at those Boyce cylinders as well. I'm planning on hydro-assist bolting over the manual steering. Right now I'm thinking of two single-ended rams welded to the differential housing & bolted to either the tie rod or steering arm(s). The control valve is undecided. I like the drag link valve posted a few weeks ago.

But I have a few projects above that on the list. We'll see how many I can knock off this summer.
 

rat3208

New member
9
0
0
Location
npr, fl
hydro-assist is by far the best system it's nowhere near as touchy as full-hydro, and you don't get the kick-back of a standard power steering when off-road due to the ram on the axle.
 

JasonS

Well-known member
1,642
126
63
Location
Eastern SD
:ditto:



I've looked at those Boyce cylinders as well. I'm planning on hydro-assist bolting over the manual steering. Right now I'm thinking of two single-ended rams welded to the differential housing & bolted to either the tie rod or steering arm(s). The control valve is undecided. I like the drag link valve posted a few weeks ago.

But I have a few projects above that on the list. We'll see how many I can knock off this summer.
What don't you like about the Boyce kit?

I'd be interested in which drag link valve you are referring to. Garrison Mfg makes a new drag link valve with correct ball studs but they are spendy. They will also make standard drag links for those who want to do alternative steering boxes but don't want to weld together one.
 

Unforgiven

New member
675
17
0
Location
Las Vegas, NV
Garrison Mfg makes a new drag link valve with correct ball studs but they are spendy
Would you happen to have a link to the exact model? Is it a simple swap with the stock drag link? If it's a 20 minute pull-out-put-in type swap I'd gladly pay more.

I like Boyce's cylinders. I just want to run two cylinders mounted to the pumpkin under the differential's pinion input. From there either clamp them to opposite ends of the tie rod or to the tie rod ends. I want to avoid replacing the tie rod with a double-ended cylinder.
 

jesusgatos

Active member
2,689
28
38
Location
on the road - in CA right now
Only thing about the Boyce kit is that there doesn't appear to be much to it. Looks like a pretty basic agricultural-style ram and a couple of tabs. Coming from Boyce I'd guess it's pretty spendy too. Not knocking the quality or the company, just saying that I'd be more inclined to buy a ram and cut my own brackets. Just too simple. Especially when I can't see any reason to duplicate the bolt-on tie-rod mount. If you're going to be welding on the axle anyway...
 

jesusgatos

Active member
2,689
28
38
Location
on the road - in CA right now
No reason you can't do that, but don't think you'd want to use two cylinders that were sized to be used independently. Would want/need to choose cylinders that were of the appropriate size to be used together in tandem like that. Make sense?
 

Unforgiven

New member
675
17
0
Location
Las Vegas, NV
Wouldn't the cylinders both have to extend the full lenthth of the tie rod travel? I guess I don't quite understand how to set up a two cylinder assist. I saw an example of it on the PSC website. It mounted up high to two custom steer arms. But I don't see why it couldn't be mounted lower & attached to the tie rod.

I'm hoping to avoid replacing the tie rod with the three-piece double-ended cylinder.

I'm doing this upgrade soon, within the next 2 months or so. Any suggestions on particular parts are welcome as I need to start gathering info & parts.
 

jesusgatos

Active member
2,689
28
38
Location
on the road - in CA right now
If you haven't already seen it, start by reading this, specifically this part (scroll down to the Two Unbalanced, cross-connected double-acting piston-type hydraulic cylinders part). No reason why you can't use two rams set up like you're thinking. Just need to select the right size rams for that application. Effective bore size is just as important as the stroke. That's why I was saying that you probably don't want to just use two of those Boyce rams.
 

JasonS

Well-known member
1,642
126
63
Location
Eastern SD
Would you happen to have a link to the exact model? Is it a simple swap with the stock drag link? If it's a 20 minute pull-out-put-in type swap I'd gladly pay more.

I like Boyce's cylinders. I just want to run two cylinders mounted to the pumpkin under the differential's pinion input. From there either clamp them to opposite ends of the tie rod or to the tie rod ends. I want to avoid replacing the tie rod with a double-ended cylinder.
The drag link is basically a G21 valve one one end with the other end custom built. The trouble is, it is a $1200 drag link. Hard to justify if the HF54 can be done for significantly less. I have been hoping to fine a G21 in a salvage yard and get just the balance of parts from Garrison.
 

deathrowdave

Active member
384
76
28
Location
falmouth, ky
I used the Garrison G21 type of control valve and fabed a new steering arm on the axle . Found mine on an old fire truck. Early ('68-72) Chevrolet and GMC 40-60 series had the same assist steering system also. Thousands of soft drink delivery trucks in salvage yards. Google -Rural Truck Parts in Sparta , Ky. Terry and help you out , reasonable he is a collector and has a few military pieces. 8)
 
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