Dennis, Shelby, and improvised fording engineering

[rmgill]

I think the biggest issue for making an extemporized fording kit is the regulator to put out 2-4 PSI of air into the bellhousing and on your breather lines for the axles.

When you prepare to do this work, make sure you split your breathers for the fuel tanks from the lines for your airpack and master cylinder. They're not so compatible and there were MWOs to make a change to split them. The fittings are tricky to find but oddly enough can be located at the autoparts stores in the Brake Line sections.

It's my understanding that pressurizing the engine, bell housing AND axles is a very good idea for better fording capabilities. Running the lines for the axles shouldn't be too difficult. 2 Tees and 2 Ends plus 3 hoses with not a lot of pressure to hold. Being able to pressurize the transmission and transfer box would seem a good idea too.

 

[gene]

Bjorn, Freight Train, Thanks for the additional information. This thread should get me started. I will try to only PM you guys when I hit the brick wall. Your right, many things are self evident once you dive in and get started. Appreciate the specification of copper tubing along the frame and the selection of flex material to the axles.

Gene

 

[gene]

Just read your post Ryan. Thanks as well.

 

[rmgill]

Bjorn is right with regards to the newer materials, but I prefer to go with the original parts copper lines, double flare ends, etc). When/if I make my fording kit, I'm going to try to engineer things as much as possible so they look correct. My Fuel tank installation uses military parts and looks pretty darn correct (still needs a label for the dash power selector for fuel tanks.

I'll be looking for a fording regulator at MV events since the shops seem to charge an arm and a leg for them.

 

[CCATLETT1984]

since the back issues of MVM are on there site now, can someone just post the issue that the article is in. then everyone can go to the magazine site a look at it.

 

[Recovry4x4]

118 is the oldest issue on there and the fording articles were further back.

 

[cranetruck]

Articles by yours truly are listed here (the Biodiesel and Grounding articles are not listed, though):

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/index.php?module=pagesetter&func=viewpub&tid=3&pid=23

 

[sailor2000]

An amazing list of articles Bjorn... almost 'everything you ever wanted to know'... how do we see them?

 

[Lax]

Ditto!

 

[cranetruck]

Thanks.
Perhaps jagjetta (John, MVM editor) can make some available in pdf format, like some of the recent articles, although, I'd like to edit some of them with new info that has come to light after long discussions here on this forum.

 

[Lax]

Great! Thank you.

 

[houdel]

pressurizing the engine, bell housing AND axles ..... transmission and transfer box would seem a good idea

Seems like a good idea, except for the engine. It is already pretty well "pressurized" by leakage past the piston rings. If one attempted to pressurize it from the air system they would have to block off the breather tube or risk running the truck out of air. Maybe a check valve in the breather tube?

As for the low pressure regulator, how about one off a portable propane tank? They are in the right pressure range, some of them are adjustable to fine tune the pressure, and when you remove the inlet and outlet fittings the body is threaded NPT.

 

[Recovry4x4]

Bjorn, he is working on a project that just may tickle all of us as far as articles on specific vehicles. Not sure when or how he's going to unveil this idea.

 

[rmgill]

Well, the fording kit for the M813s had a valve that put air into the valve cover which, presumably pressurized the crank case with air. I'd have to wonder why Deuces don't have a similar configuration.

 

[houdel]

You are talking about vehicles from two different eras. The Deuce technology dates from the 50's and 60's when pollution was not a concern and engines had open draft tubes spewing blowby out into the air. The M800 series was made in the 70's and 80's and had to meet EPA air quality standards. Draft tubes were replaced by positive crankcase ventilation systems which recycled crankcase blowby into the air intake manifold.

The M800 engine probably operates at a slight negative crankcase pressure thus the need for pressurization when fording. The multifuels, if the road tube were blocked, would have a slight positive crankcase pressure, thus all that is necessary for deep water fording is to tie the draft tube into the air cleaner inlet to keep water out of the draft tube.

 

[area52]

I have used www.clippard.com for my air regulator needs for my onboard air system on my rock crawler.

They have a lot of small valve parts and regulators.

 

[cranetruck]

.....The multifuels, if the road tube were blocked, would have a slight positive crankcase pressure, thus all that is necessary for deep water fording is to tie the draft tube into the air cleaner inlet to keep water out of the draft tube.

Without filtering the fumes, the air filter would be terribly fauled by the oil carried out. Also, if enough oil is present a slight chance of engine runaway exists.
The lds465-2 was designed to operate completely submerged and dumps the crankcase fumes into the exhaust pipe. A valve controls the pressure when pressurization is turned "on" (the only prep required for this vehicle prior to fording/swimming, even brakedrums are pressurized).

My deuce has long been fitted with a crankcase breather filter and safely recirculates the fumes. A sump collects the oil, which can also be returned to the crankcase. It is "fording ready" to 5 ft by plugging the bellhousing and turning a valve on for pressurization.

 

[Lax]

The question still remains. How can one make a "fordable" M35 without having to find a stock fording kit? For new guys like me I would really like to find the directions to find the parts (off the shelf?) and the instructions on how to install it if possible.

I just don't even know where to start. Thanks.

 

[sailor2000]

Did anyone come up with a way to read Bjorns old articles?

 

[cranetruck]

....
I just don't even know where to start. Thanks.

Start with any part of it and one thing will lead to another.


Leave the breather vents stock, just make sure they work, take them off and try breathing through them, they are one-way valves.

Connect the compressor air intake to the engine air filter canister, there is a hose nipple on the side for this. BTW, this connection can be made permanent.

Get an elbow for the air intake mushroom. A muffler shop will have one.

Get the low pressure air regulator, valve and plumbing from a parts truck.

The TM shows a check valve between the air tanks as part of the deep water fording system, get one from a parts truck if you don't have one. Technically not needed for fording, but....

The crankcase breather tube must be extended if fording more than a couple of feet of water.
Not much to it really and remember that fording ops are usually very short in duration, less than a minute, but will always require a complete wheel bearing service routine to check for water entry if water gets above the axles....no other way to know...along with a check of all fluids for water contamination, including the fuel.

The air filter canister has no drain, so you need to crack it open too and make sure no water is sloshing around in it.
The after fording procedures for the deuce are a PITA.

Regarding copies of the articles, they can be scanned or copied and sent to you privately to avoid copyright issues. I have done that a number of times when asked nicely.
Look for back isssues at MV swap meets or ebay.