Diagnostic Readers

[Third From Texas]

So I have a couple readers coming for my A1R.

I picked up a cheap Deerbrorn DPA4 for the diagnostics and have a Bluefire on the way as well. Sort of redundant, but one is for the CAT ET diag softyware and the other is just to project the real-time data for a display. I've had the Bluefire my cart for some four years now waiting on someone else to Guinea pig it.. LOL

A user on FB has sorted out how to get the Bluefire running a few months back (had to change a 24v pin to provide 12v) . It's exactly what I had hoped it would look like and it's quite customizable to show whatever gauges you want.

*keep in mind, these talk to the ECU in the A1 and A1R trucks and won't work on the A0 afaik



I'll have to sort out how to modify the port for the Bluefire. But I also want to retain use of the Deerborn DPA4 so I may have to tap in and add a second port (one OEM and perhaps one modified for the Bluefire). I'll have to ponder the two devices when they arrive.

 

[GeneralDisorder]

There's really no need to have a second port. You won't need the Bluefire when CAT ET is connected and I'm not even sure the ECM will allow that and/or it may confuse one or the other. Laptop with CAT ET and the DPA and the cables will not be something you want to permanently install.

On the other hand if you have to modify the port side of the truck for the Bluefire then you definitely want to wire it up on it's own to the bus in case that modification interferes with the DPA4.

With the DPA4 you must have software for each computer - engine, trans, ABS, etc and with the exception of the CTIS software, none of it is "free". But it does offer a lot more in terms of ability to read manufacturer specific data, run tests (like cylinder cut-out for example) and has all the advantages of a laptop - access to TM's, wiring diagrams, troubleshooting procedures, etc.

The Bluefire is only going to display generic data. That is data that all like components (like engines in general, or transmission in general) complying with the J1939 and J1708 standards output. It's like the difference between the government mandated generic OBD-II protocol and the manufacturer specific protocol's that provide significantly more functionality like programming, etc.

 

[hike]

So I have a couple readers coming for my A1R.

I picked up a cheap Deerbrorn DPA4 for the diagnostics and have a Bluefire on the way as well. Sort of redundant, but one is for the CAT ET diag softyware and the other is just to project the real-time data for a display. I've had the Bluefire my cart for some four years now waiting on someone else to Guinea pig it.. LOL

A user on FB has sorted out how to get the Bluefire running a few months back (had to change a 24v pin to provide 12v) . It's exactly what I had hoped it would look like and it's quite customizable to show whatever gauges you want.

*keep in mind, these talk to the ECU in the A1 and A1R trucks and won't work on the A0 afaik

View attachment 908140

I'll have to sort out how to modify the port for the Bluefire. But I also want to retain use of the Deerborn DPA4 so I may have to tap in and add a second port (one OEM and perhaps one modified for the Bluefire). I'll have to ponder the two devices when they arrive.

So, adapting the existing (to 12v) or adding an additional 12v nine pin plug allows us to create our own 'dash' display on our iPad, iphone, Surface or whatever andriod device one might have? Creating active real time data display while driving from our engine, transmission, etcetera?

 

[chucky]

So I have a couple readers coming for my A1R.

I picked up a cheap Deerbrorn DPA4 for the diagnostics and have a Bluefire on the way as well. Sort of redundant, but one is for the CAT ET diag softyware and the other is just to project the real-time data for a display. I've had the Bluefire my cart for some four years now waiting on someone else to Guinea pig it.. LOL

A user on FB has sorted out how to get the Bluefire running a few months back (had to change a 24v pin to provide 12v) . It's exactly what I had hoped it would look like and it's quite customizable to show whatever gauges you want.

*keep in mind, these talk to the ECU in the A1 and A1R trucks and won't work on the A0 afaik

View attachment 908140

I'll have to sort out how to modify the port for the Bluefire. But I also want to retain use of the Deerborn DPA4 so I may have to tap in and add a second port (one OEM and perhaps one modified for the Bluefire). I'll have to ponder the two devices when they arrive.

My concern comes from you sitting in the red light district of CC with your passenger door open with known sex workers in clear view on a sunday night and a roofie filled water bottle in plain view !!!! Arnt you afraid that you could be spending too much money ? Theyre cheaper on friday nights !

 

[Third From Texas]

So, adapting the existing (to 12v) or adding an additional 12v nine pin plug allows us to create our own 'dash' display on our iPad, iphone, Surface or whatever andriod device one might have? Creating active real time data display while driving from our engine, transmission, etcetera?

Yes.

Via the Bluefire adaptor:

BlueFire LLC

bluefire-llc.com

The Bluefire requires one of the 9-pins to be converted from 24v to 12v (else you will smoke the Bluefire) as per the guy on FB who smoked his first couple Bluefires. The solution was to alter one fo the 9-pin and convert it from 24v to 12v.. Then the Bluefire pushes real-time data to your tablet (see pic). I haven't chatted up the guy who got it working, so I'm not sure which pin needs to be repowered, but I will find out.

My thinking (which may be incorrect) is that if the DPA4 in OEM configuration is looking for the OEM 24v....it *may* not work. I don't know (that's what I'll have to ask @GeneralDisorder . But to get the Bluefire to work (without burning it up) you have to change the 24v pwr pin to 12v. Will the DPA4 work in that configuration? I don't know. That's what I need to assess. If it won't then I need to tap a "Y" off with one device powered with 24v and thge other with 12v. Or it's possilbe the DPA4 will work the modification (but the Bluefire WILL smoke if you push 24v thru it).

 

[Third From Texas]

My concern comes from you sitting in the red light district of CC with your passenger door open with known sex workers in clear view on a sunday night and a roofie filled water bottle in plain view !!!! Arnt you afraid that you could be spending too much money ? Theyre cheaper on friday nights !

Not a problem.

I usually just watch the back of their heads at stops ....but eyes forward while driving.

The fancy display and all the lights and buttons? That's just to impress the chicks anyway.

 

[GeneralDisorder]

The DPA3/4/4+ should work with 12v no problem. I've bench flashed ECM's with 12v, 14.5v, 24v, and 28v and neither the CAT computer nor the DPA seem to care at all.

 

[Third From Texas]

ou won't need the Bluefire when CAT ET is connected and I'm not even sure the ECM will allow that and/or it may confuse one or the other. Laptop with CAT ET and the DPA and the cables will not be something you want to permanently install.

Understood. Yes, they are "either or" devices. The Bluefire is just for display while driving.

On the other hand if you have to modify the port side of the truck for the Bluefire then you definitely want to wire it up on it's own to the bus in case that modification interferes with the DPA4.

Yep. The port will require modification (or a second modified port) to run the Bluefire. *unless the DPA4 doesn't care about being dropped down to 12v

With the DPA4 you must have software for each computer - engine, trans, ABS, etc and with the exception of the CTIS software, none of it is "free". But it does offer a lot more in terms of ability to read manufacturer specific data, run tests (like cylinder cut-out for example) and has all the advantages of a laptop - access to TM's, wiring diagrams, troubleshooting procedures, etc.

Yeah, I'll have to locate a copy of CAT ET, etc *somewhere*.

The Bluefire is only going to display generic data. That is data that all like components (like engines in general, or transmission in general) complying with the J1939 and J1708 standards output.

Yep. The sole reason for purchasing the Bluefire. I want to display some additional real--time ECU data while running (as in the pic).

 

[Third From Texas]

The DPA3/4/4+ should work with 12v no problem. I've bench flashed ECM's with 12v, 14.5v, 24v, and 28v and neither the CAT computer nor the DPA seem to care at all.

Awesome.

That was what I was hoping to hear !

 

[Third From Texas]

So it appears that my DPA4+ is a Type 1 (black) and the truck is a Type2 (green).

Basically, on the truck side there are two pins that are just slightly smaller than the others. The 9-pin plug/connector that came with the DPA4+ has all 9 pins the same size.

So I "think" I need this to mate the two:

https://www.amazon.com/YPP-Adapter-Connector-Diagnostic-Trackers/dp/B08789MVG6/ref=pd_day0fbt_sccl_1/147-8265688-8007957

 

[GeneralDisorder]

Yeah that looks right. Odd it didn't come with a type 2 also. They do make a type 2 cable for the DPA that doesn't need an adapter. Even my DPA-3 has the type 2 adapter.

 

[Third From Texas]

Yeah that looks right. Odd it didn't come with a type 2 also. They do make a type 2 cable for the DPA that doesn't need an adapter. Even my DPA-3 has the type 2 adapter.

It was one of those open box, demo deals. It did come with two cables but one is the little 14z pin-to-serial and the other a type-1 9-pin.

 

[Lostchain]

So it appears that my DPA4+ is a Type 1 (black) and the truck is a Type2 (green).

Basically, on the truck side there are two pins that are just slightly smaller than the others. The 9-pin plug/connector that came with the DPA4+ has all 9 pins the same size.

Are you sure you got a genuine unit? Amazon and eBay are rife with cheap Chinese knockoffs.


Here are pictures of my genuine DPA 3 Plus and DPA 4 Plus and both of them have 9Pin connectors with 2 smaller pins. Both have been plugged up to multiple military trucks with no need for adapters. I personally wouldn’t go “adapting” things to plug into the data bus. If you fry it, you will be sad.

 

[Third From Texas]

Are you sure you got a genuine unit? Amazon and eBay are rife with cheap Chinese knockoffs.


Here are pictures of my genuine DPA 3 Plus and DPA 4 Plus and both of them have 9Pin connectors with 2 smaller pins. Both have been plugged up to multiple military trucks with no need for adapters. I personally wouldn’t go “adapting” things to plug into the data bus. If you fry it, you will be sad.

Never sure of anything online. But for $150 if it works, I'll be happy. Supposed to be demo units direct from DG.

The return address matches up with DB in MI. The packing list indicates it's from them. And the box had DB Tech packing tape enclosing it. But you could tell someone just rolled it up in some bubble wrap and sealed the box (but it was sold as used/demo). If it's a fake they went to a lot of trouble to spoof DB Tech. Even the cables have shrink wrapped DB Tech part numbers. It's just didn't include a type2 cable.

My bet is that it's legit. But as I said...Internet. Never know...

Dearborn Group's Protocol Vehicle Adapter, DPA4 Plus + | eBay

The DPA4 Plus is a PC-based pass-thru device that works in conjunction with OEM software to provide OEM-level diagnostic and ECU reprogramming functionality. Note, this is our older model adapter and it will only read 1 CAN channel.

www.ebay.com

 

[Lostchain]

My bet is that it's legit. But as I said...Internet. Never know...

looks legit… so your truck has a type 2 green j1939 connector? My understanding was those went on 500kbps CAN bus vehicles 2016 and newer?

 

[Third From Texas]

looks legit… so your truck has a type 2 green j1939 connector? My understanding was those went on 500kbps CAN bus vehicles 2016 and newer?

Or maybe it's the other way around.

The truck has this configuration where the pins shown here at 5:00 and 7:00 are smaller diameter.



The male connector I received has all fat pins (and wont fit). In any event, I need a cable or an adaptor that has the two smaller pins.

 

[Third From Texas]

Looking more closely at the adaptor I linked, I don't think it's going to work.

This is what came with the DPA4. Note all the plastic pins are the same size, The ones at 7:00 and 5:00 won't fit in t the truck receiver port.

 

[Third From Texas]

I think I'll be better off just finding a 15 pin serial -to- Type 1 cable.

I have no idea what this one they sent me really is (it doesn't appear to be type 1 or type 2).

The problem is I can't find a cable in that configuration. Not even on DP's site (you can buy the entire kit with all the cables).

LOL

 

[GeneralDisorder]

Call DG and ask them?

 

[corycoryh]

Not sure if this helps anyone, but I have a 2003 (refreshed by Acela however) and running this splitter: https://www.amazon.ca/gp/aw/d/B0CHRCLDP2

Which is connected to a Scanguage D and a Blue Fire dongle. While I haven't driven the truck much, both function fine (over 30+ min of testing ) and read data at the same time. Maybe the Blue Fire will burn up shortly, maybe the 24v is reduced by the split, or maybe Acela tweaked it, but all seems fine. If I remember I'll put a meter on the plug and see what it says.