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Interest 2.5 ton to 5 ton wheel adapters

blackrock

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Ok guys before i get to deep in designing these is there any interest? Im thinking off the top of my head its going to be $250-$350 each. My flanges on my axle housings are $125ea. These adapters will be much larger with more machining. Give me your thoughts. I have a design in mind but what to see the interest is there. Thanks Kyle
 

KsM715

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St George Ks
Here's my 2cents.

Will they include wheel studs?

$250-$350 plus the cost of the 5ton wheel (most will go with HEMMT wheels, with the thicker centers) + the cost of getting studs for those wheels (if not included with the adapter)...............I'd just buy some already converted HEMMT wheels for less.

Edit: You are talking about an adapter the will allow you to run unmodified 5ton wheels on a deuce right?
 
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ODdave

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I have a feeling not many will be able to afford them.

P.S. I know its off subject but what planetaries are you running on the sheatmetal housings? Clarks?
 

blackrock

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Here's my 2cents.

Will they include wheel studs?

$250-$350 plus the cost of the 5ton wheel (most will go with HEMMT wheels, with the thicker centers) + the cost of getting studs for those wheels (if not included with the adapter)...............I'd just buy some already converted HEMMT wheels for less.

Edit: You are talking about an adapter the will allow you to run unmodified 5ton wheels on a deuce right?


Yes, they will b ready to bolt on with new studs installed. I agree much cheaper to just buy the plates to convert the wheels but i like offering customers options. I already have the bolt on plates being quoted at the laser shop. Thanks for the input





I have a feeling not many will be able to afford them.

P.S. I know its off subject but what planetaries are you running on the sheatmetal housings? Clarks?
I know that's the problem is the cost. But, like i said above i like offering options. If just one person was interested, that enough for me to make a set.

Whatever planetaries the customer wants. SO far i have built them from clark 20 tons (which dominate the marker) and Pettybone's .
 

pand9

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Blackrock
I have been looking into making my own. As I do have the machinary to do it myself. The old fasioned manual method. So far my cost for stock per adapter is about $230.00. 14" dia X 1 1/2" steel blanks and studs. Now add in the Hours it will take to machine the first one. So at 250 each I would be interested in a set. I believe Hemmit wheels will need to be chamfered as they are hub centric and even with 1 1/2" thick blanks there is not enouogh material to leave a sufficient shoulder to center the wheel on. My question in this adapter is mounting it to the existing hub flange. The original studs must be removed from the hub. Studs are then pressed into the adapter so that the stud may then pass thru the hub and nuts applied on the back side of the hub. Should not the back side of the hub be chamfered so the taperd side of the nut may then center the stud from the adapter ? Or has anyone found a stud with enough spline to pass thru the adapter and into the hub.
 

blackrock

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Are the HEMTT rims hub-centric? Would the adapter be aluminum?
The hemmits are bud style so the lug nut centers the wheel of the chamfer of the nut. No they would be steel adapters.



Blackrock
I have been looking into making my own. As I do have the machinary to do it myself. The old fasioned manual method. So far my cost for stock per adapter is about $230.00. 14" dia X 1 1/2" steel blanks and studs. Now add in the Hours it will take to machine the first one. So at 250 each I would be interested in a set. I believe Hemmit wheels will need to be chamfered as they are hub centric and even with 1 1/2" thick blanks there is not enouogh material to leave a sufficient shoulder to center the wheel on. My question in this adapter is mounting it to the existing hub flange. The original studs must be removed from the hub. Studs are then pressed into the adapter so that the stud may then pass thru the hub and nuts applied on the back side of the hub. Should not the back side of the hub be chamfered so the taperd side of the nut may then center the stud from the adapter ? Or has anyone found a stud with enough spline to pass thru the adapter and into the hub.
Why press the studs out from the deuce? what i am thinking is making the flange thicker than 1.5" (not sure how thick yet) make the 6 thru deuce holes only .01" over sized (in the adapter) and just use flanged cap nuts (like 99-03 ford super dutys) This way you can still check to make sure all your lugs are tight and with the holes only being over sized by .01" that about of run out is neglectable. Press new longer studs in for the 5ton bolt pattern on the out side.
But i really need to draw this all up to see sizing.

Thanks Kyle
 

blackrock

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OK when i get home tonight ill try and draft something up to get a better idea on size and how it will look. Ill try to post an update tomorrow. Thanks Kyle
 

Jtspendy

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Vineland NJ
How about an adapter to use tractor trailer rims? THe R22.5 has a lot of options in tires I was looking at GI-337 its an on road off road tractor trailer tire that is 11R22.5 thats speed rated for 65 mph and has a decent tire pattern
 

treeguy

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I don't know how to add a direct link to a thread, but look at this - Bobbed engine swap and hydo powersteering. Cuukvee85 has a deuce to 10 lug adapter already and has the drawings for them. My concern with this type of adapter is how much back space are you commited to with that nifty hunk of material bolted to your axles? You have to press out the deuce studs, press them into the adapter and put the nuts on the inside of the hub flanges, then press in 10 new studs for your wheels. Honestly, I'd just go with a modified 10 holer. Less stuff, its been discussed before, why'd ya want to go thru the reverse deuce stud bolt/nut reversed deal and be semi commited to? And if you have an issue, it would be real simple to just throw a 6 holer back on with no hassle. I see that with the adapter you could use any 10 hole wheel (theoretically), but once you find the right wheel to adapt to 6 holes, why look back?

FMTV's are an option to modify to 6 holes also. If you had a thick chunk of 6 to 10 adapter that gave you too much back spacing with a HEMTT wheel, maybe a stock FMTV wheel would be the ticket. These wheels have a huge back spacing and would work well with a thick 6 hole adapter.

Blackrock, the issue with pressing out the 6 deuce studs is because of the physical material interferance with the area needed for the 10 holes. The diameters are close enough to be a problem, you can't have both.
 
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pand9

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Treeguy
I have seen the adapters on Cuukvee85's truck. A quidk compliment to his skill and workmanship. His work needs to be seen to be apppreciated. The plates are machined from 1.5" plate. I have his drawing and without looking I believe the final thickness was 1.416". Enough was cut to be shure the faces were true to eachother.
I tried to contact the company that manufactured his, but it appears that they are no longer in business. Plus the original cost was way more than most would even consider.
 

frodobaggins

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Ruston, La
I just don't understand how this can be so expensive. It's a metal plate with 16 holes and some hardware.
Can someone explain to me how this adds up. And does it have to be so thick ?

Questions I'd like to know:
What kind of steel ?
Why does it have to be 1.5" thick ?
How much are the studs ?

I'm not trying to be an ass or anything, but it seems like everyone who tries to tackle this problem runs into
a big cost problem. It seems pretty straight forward but I am not a machinist. The cad work is already done,
the dimensions are known, etc.

So seriously, can someone explain to me how this can be so much money ? Obviously there needs to be profit in
it and I get that, but the rest, I just don't understand.
 

blackrock

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Phoenixville,Pa
I don't know how to add a direct link to a thread, but look at this - Bobbed engine swap and hydo powersteering. Cuukvee85 has a deuce to 10 lug adapter already and has the drawings for them. My concern with this type of adapter is how much back space are you commited to with that nifty hunk of material bolted to your axles? You have to press out the deuce studs, press them into the adapter and put the nuts on the inside of the hub flanges, then press in 10 new studs for your wheels. Honestly, I'd just go with a modified 10 holer. Less stuff, its been discussed before, why'd ya want to go thru the reverse deuce stud bolt/nut reversed deal and be semi commited to? And if you have an issue, it would be real simple to just throw a 6 holer back on with no hassle. I see that with the adapter you could use any 10 hole wheel (theoretically), but once you find the right wheel to adapt to 6 holes, why look back?

FMTV's are an option to modify to 6 holes also. If you had a thick chunk of 6 to 10 adapter that gave you too much back spacing with a HEMTT wheel, maybe a stock FMTV wheel would be the ticket. These wheels have a huge back spacing and would work well with a thick 6 hole adapter.

Blackrock, the issue with pressing out the 6 deuce studs is because of the physical material interferance with the area needed for the 10 holes. The diameters are close enough to be a problem, you can't have both.
Treeguy, i guess i need to just draw it up and see where the conflicting arcs are. Cause i can't see why they would conflict.
 

treeguy

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Blackrock, if you look at the attached picture from Cuukvee you will see how close the two studs are (imagine two circles). There will not be enough room to spin one or the other but not both nuts, even if the deuce pattern is counter sunk. Cuukvee has the drawing for this type of adapter, but as you can see the deuce studs are reversed. He says that there is enough space in the back of the truck's front hub to run the nuts.

Frodo, I am up against a wall with my converson plates because of the cost. The cost is run up respectivly due to where you live. To get anything machined in my local area the reputable shops are charging $85-$100+ per hour. I was quoted $4000 for my job (6 plates fully machined including materials) and that was without cutting out the centers of the original rim. The cost of bar stock is also a problem. This estimate is for 4110 (something like that) steel. The shop said that the price of a lesser grade steel would not make much differance. This material would be cut like a pizza out of a bar 20" in diameter (my plates need to be 19" diameter). My raw pizzas were going to cost about $268 for one piece. Using flat 1/2" plate is not as an accurate way to go due to the plate's internal stresses (as explaned to me, released from the larger product and then would have to be machined flat). With bars you can get a variety of better quality material (I believe). The pizzas will have to be machine faced on both sides to ensure parallel and smoothness, 1/2" plate should also be faced to ensure the same tolerances, but then you end up with less (slightly) than the 1/2" that we want. The bottom line is, cost of material plus the machining which is to tight tolerances and designs and must be repeated 6 times (for me anyway). Shops need set up time and they concider small projects of 6 pieces not really a waste of time, but if they ran off 100 then you'd save on set up time and programing the machines. Kind of like if you called Grainger for one plastic 5 gal. bucket and had to pay the shipping as uposed to ordering 1000 buckets and getting a bulk discount.

On another point that I'd like to make here, slightly different issue but similar. I'm going for the bolt in plate design from the back side to get my appropriate back spacing. There will need to be 4-6 welds as I will explain and the need for LOCATOR PINS. This is for my FMTV wheels, but also should be for the same set up for HEMTT's. I am at a loss as to why no one has gone this route to ensure smooth running. So here is the assembly procedure.

Jack up one front end tire on your deuce so you can spin it
Bolt the new adapter plate to that axle (studs pressed in facing out)
Slide the larger/inner wheel half onto the plate and slight wrench tighten 3 opposing nuts
Using a dial indicator, spin the wheel and check the bead seat for runout
Because the few nuts are semi loose you can keep fiddling with the wheel to get less than 1/16" differance when spun
Once satisfied, tighten the nuts good
Remove the wheel (or not) from the truck and spot weld the plate to this wheel half in a handfull of places
Remount to the axle and remove the nuts
Slide on the outer wheel half and throw on a handfull of nuts like before
Use the dial indicator on this new outer bead edge to check its runout and adjust like before
Tighten the nuts once you are happy
(once the tire is mounted you could get a thumping action due to the beads not running in a circular path on the new plate if you don't do this)
Now that the wheel is all bolted together (heres the secret) remove it from the truck
Drill a diamter hole that everyone here can agree upon thru ALL THREE plates between the studs (I'm going with two holes)
Find a tool steel pin of the same diameter (you could weld one end to the back of the plate)
Disassemble this wheel and install the rubber
Slide in the locator pins and bolt together the outer wheel half
Repeat 5 more times

This is all in an attempt to keep the two halves in a circular position EVERY time the wheel is taken appart and put back together. There is play where the studs go into the outer wheel half and you will not be able to achieve uniform assembly without the locator pins. The spot welds are required so that the inner wheel half doesn't lose its position with the new plate (these two have to stay together).

If you have bolt in adapter plates I think that this will make assembly much easier and ensure accuracy.
 

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