Lets talk offroad upgrades .....

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CivilEGR

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Detroit, MI
Got into a bit of fun over the weekend. Kept the air intake above water so she kept on running and never swamped out. Although with the fan running, I'm sure it swallowed enough. Not to mention the water over the bench seat and some wet pants.

First question, anything I should check to make sure I didn't damage in this little incident?

Second, once I was pulled out, my power steering seemed to be gone for awhile. I opened the hood and made sure there was no junk left in the engine bay, and after awhile it seemed to come back and work.

Finally, I guess it's time to put a 2" hitch on the front and back and invest in a cradle winch. Should I keep a 24v winch system or go wit a 12v winch? How should I run a wire to the rear?

 

98G

Former SSG
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Time to repack wheel bearings and grease everything that went under. Check diff fluid for water ingress, as well as crankcase and transmission.

I'd stick with a 24v winch and power it from the slave port on the front. For powering it from the rear of the truck i'd mount another slave port and wire it with 3/0 cable to the same termination points that the front slave port uses.
 

Rutjes

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Amersfoort, The Netherlands
I've been tearing apart my front axle (Dana 60) and the tubes are full of rust and dirt. It also started to work it's way through the inner axle seals as you can see here:

IMG-20200526-WA0003.jpegIMG-20200526-WA0005.jpeg

From what I've learned our trucks didn't come with proper outer axle seals. If you're going to be going through water and/or mud it seems to be a must have. I'm ordering these.

Can't tell you about the rear axle yet, as I haven't started on that yet.
 

ehuppert

Member
178
21
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Location
Upstate NY
Check transmission for water! If frothy you'll be drilling and tapping convertor to get it all out.... Pull rear brake drums. Mud will do bad things in rear brakes and all bearings (f&R)! Probably drain and clean front diff. These vehicles are not, and never were really good about deep water fording! As a 63B way back when these were new i went down this path! Actually old enough i also went through this with the M880's!
 

Sharecropper

Well-known member
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Paris KY
Got into a bit of fun over the weekend. Kept the air intake above water so she kept on running and never swamped out. Although with the fan running, I'm sure it swallowed enough. Not to mention the water over the bench seat and some wet pants.

First question, anything I should check to make sure I didn't damage in this little incident?

Second, once I was pulled out, my power steering seemed to be gone for awhile. I opened the hood and made sure there was no junk left in the engine bay, and after awhile it seemed to come back and work.

Finally, I guess it's time to put a 2" hitch on the front and back and invest in a cradle winch. Should I keep a 24v winch system or go wit a 12v winch? How should I run a wire to the rear?

Whenever I see a photo like this it makes me sad. Sad for the truck owner because he doesn’t realize the damage that been caused as a result of his “fun”. And he also doesn’t realize the time, effort, and cost of repairing the damage.

I bought my first 4WD in 1970, a brand new Toyota Landcruiser. Within 2 years I had ruined it having “fun” in mud holes and creek crossings such as the OP’s photo. I traded the Toyota in on a new 1972 Chevy K20 4WD at Lawson Chevrolet in Jasper Georgia. Since then I have owned more 4WD trucks than I can remember. With each truck, I learned.
I am currently rebuilding a M1028 and I can guarantee you it will never see a water crossing like the photo. Hail, it will lever see rain.

When that cold water hits the warm seals in the axles, engine, transmission, transfer case, Differentials, and U-joints, those rubber seals instantly shrink. Mud and water then bypass the seals and mix with whatever lubricant on the other side. This contamination ultimately leads to unit failure.

I am sad for the OP because he hasn’t yet learned the lessons I learned so long ago. His truck needs to be overhauled from one end to the other to inspect and repair the damage.
So sad.
 

CivilEGR

Member
48
10
8
Location
Detroit, MI
No reason to feel sad for me. I bought this vehicle with the intention of pushing it hard right from the start and having it be simple enough to learn to work on myself. End of the day it's just money.

So far my next steps are:
-Hose pressure wash the underside really well. No reason to power wash around seals that could leak
-Oil change and transmission flush (local shop)
-Repack wheel bearings (local shop)
-Drain both differentials and check for water/dirt. Rebuild axles if any serious amounts of dirt are found. Otherwise hose down with brake cleaner, refill with 75W90 transmission fluid, put in new gasket on rear and use gasket builder on front. Should be around 10 pints.
-Drain and refill transfer case with ATF, note any water or debris. 5 quarts.

Longer term projects:
-Add front hitch (Warn 25855)
-Add rear hitch (Draw-tite 41001)
-Winch cradle for the hitches
-24v winch, change wires to be the NATO plug.
-Run 24v line and receptacle to the back of the truck.


Last year I did all of the front end steering and Dana 60 knuckle rebuilds with the parts from ORD. I also rebuilt the engine top end and it's been a strong runner ever since.
 

CivilEGR

Member
48
10
8
Location
Detroit, MI
I've been tearing apart my front axle (Dana 60) and the tubes are full of rust and dirt. It also started to work it's way through the inner axle seals as you can see here:

View attachment 801728View attachment 801729

From what I've learned our trucks didn't come with proper outer axle seals. If you're going to be going through water and/or mud it seems to be a must have. I'm ordering these.

Can't tell you about the rear axle yet, as I haven't started on that yet.
Got around to looking into my axles. Opened the front filler plug and almost a gallon of grey sludgy fluid came out. Not even sure how that much fluid could have even gotten in there. And that's a gallon out before I've even taken the diff cover off.

Looks like I'll be going this route as well. I'll order inner and outer seals. How do I know if I need to replace the pinion seal or bearing from the driveshaft? How's your rebuild going? Any pointers other than to be aware that it's going to be a long labor intensive project? I guess this gives me an excuse to put a locker in as well.


Oh, and bonus project was found. I noticed a puddle under the rear drivers tire. Turns out there's a cracked brake line and it completely bled out.
 

Rutjes

Active member
Steel Soldiers Supporter
179
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Location
Amersfoort, The Netherlands
Got around to looking into my axles. Opened the front filler plug and almost a gallon of grey sludgy fluid came out. Not even sure how that much fluid could have even gotten in there. And that's a gallon out before I've even taken the diff cover off.

Looks like I'll be going this route as well. I'll order inner and outer seals. How do I know if I need to replace the pinion seal or bearing from the driveshaft? How's your rebuild going? Any pointers other than to be aware that it's going to be a long labor intensive project? I guess this gives me an excuse to put a locker in as well.


Oh, and bonus project was found. I noticed a puddle under the rear drivers tire. Turns out there's a cracked brake line and it completely bled out.
I'm replacing pretty much everything except the carrier and pinion bearings, they seem to be fine. I ordered the following from ORD:

- 2x D60 Spindle seal & bearing kit
- 1x D60 Yoke install kit
- 2x D60 inner axle seal
- 2x D60 outer axle seal
- 2x D60 wheel bearing kit
- 2x D60 kingpin rebuild kit
- D60 Yukon locking hub set

At the moment I have completely stripped the axle down to the bare housing. I will pressure wash the tube insides, then wire wheel and repeat until satisfied. Some brake cleaner might be used in this process. I ordered 2 300mm drill bit extensions for wire wheeling the long tube.

My kingpin bearings where full of dirt, and I used to have very bad death wobble (which I temporarily fixed at the time by adding shims on top of the kingpin springs), hence the kingpin rebuild kits.

Carrier was in pretty tight but came out by forcing it out using 2 crow bars.

I watched this video a couple times before I started to tear it down.

Btw., making something like this really makes working on the axles a lot easier:

IMG_20190819_221407.jpg
 

Karl kostman

Well-known member
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Fargo ND
I remember when I used to think about this stuff with my first Deuce, never did and just dont need the headaches of all the unnecessary maintenance that goes along with this activity!
 

cucvmule

collector of stuff
Steel Soldiers Supporter
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Location
Crystal City Mo
No reason to feel sad for me. I bought this vehicle with the intention of pushing it hard right from the start and having it be simple enough to learn to work on myself. End of the day it's just money.

So far my next steps are:
-Hose pressure wash the underside really well. No reason to power wash around seals that could leak
-Oil change and transmission flush (local shop)
-Repack wheel bearings (local shop)
-Drain both differentials and check for water/dirt. Rebuild axles if any serious amounts of dirt are found. Otherwise hose down with brake cleaner, refill with 75W90 transmission fluid, put in new gasket on rear and use gasket builder on front. Should be around 10 pints.
-Drain and refill transfer case with ATF, note any water or debris. 5 quarts.

Longer term projects:
-Add front hitch (Warn 25855)
-Add rear hitch (Draw-tite 41001)
-Winch cradle for the hitches
-24v winch, change wires to be the NATO plug.
-Run 24v line and receptacle to the back of the truck.


Last year I did all of the front end steering and Dana 60 knuckle rebuilds with the parts from ORD. I also rebuilt the engine top end and it's been a strong runner ever since.

I have to agree with you. It all depends on the reason you have it to begin with.

The military did not buy the equipment to Not Be Used. The equipment has a predetermined amount of value, time, use. After the time is up the equipment is sold for scrap and they replace with new equipment.

Fortunately some equipment survives to be "Shown" for its intended purpose or "Used" as designed.

I like to use my trucks for what they are, mules. But I maintain them to be 100% functional. Sure I have very nice trucks and I have wet mules and all in between. I have 7 trucks and, 5 tagged and 2 for the farm. The CUCV I have I am using for display, cruising, and off road. As long as the truck has aggressive rubber I would be going around you laughing as I get the recovery planned. But it is up to the owner how you use the equipment.

Some will be saved for Looking at and some will be Used and either maintained or used until scrap.
 

ridenby

Member
Steel Soldiers Supporter
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4
18
Location
Frankfort,Ky
OP, a winch that you swap around sounds well and good. It is not . Places winch too low,it will be in harms way. The front hitch will be a catch point. Best to mount your winch high on front of truck. If you want a rear do a mount in bed . As for winch choice china winch of 12000lbs will work well. I like syn rope.
Please keep us informed as you drain and refill each unit. Picture of the lowest I would mount winch. And just a random of some folks I ride with. I hate Mud75388435_565742934178994_4980006183050936320_o.jpg72244037_529373551144883_4100848324842618880_n.jpg
 

CivilEGR

Member
48
10
8
Location
Detroit, MI
I plan on leaving the axle on my truck to work on. And I'm also planning on leaving the knuckles on if possible.

So far I've ordered 2 inner and 2 outer axle seals. Grease to re-grease the wheel bearings when I put them back together. And a spindle nut socket.

And while I have everything pulled apart, I might as well put a locker in it, so I ordered one of these: Dana Locker

Lastly, I also need to replace that broken back brake line. It looks like this one will fit: Brake Line
 

Curtisje

Active member
276
112
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Location
Twentynine Palms, CA
20191020_141630.jpg
I'd mount a winch behind the bumper or make a bumper like some do (I did) and mount it in there. I had a winch mounted above the bumper and twisted the mount down and forward during a hard pull while recovering another vehicle.

Anyway, have fun. I have to clean and rebuild something on my rig all the time.
 

CivilEGR

Member
48
10
8
Location
Detroit, MI
OK, what's the secret to getting the inner axle seals out? I had a 1.5" pipe on hand and I was pushing it down the axle tube until I thought I was hitting the ridge of the seal, then pounding on it. I almost pounded the truck of the stands and that seal didn't pop out. I'm trying to avoid having to buy the seal remover kit for a one time build.
 

CivilEGR

Member
48
10
8
Location
Detroit, MI


Progress is being made. To get the seals out I found a few washers that matched my tube diameter, which I then was able to put down with a pipe and pound on. Inner seals popped right out. New seals all around, locker installed. Have to work out some issues on one of the locking hubs.
 

Chaski

Active member
672
30
28
Location
Burney/CA
Got around to looking into my axles. Opened the front filler plug and almost a gallon of grey sludgy fluid came out. Not even sure how that much fluid could have even gotten in there. And that's a gallon out before I've even taken the diff cover off.

Looks like I'll be going this route as well. I'll order inner and outer seals. How do I know if I need to replace the pinion seal or bearing from the driveshaft? How's your rebuild going? Any pointers other than to be aware that it's going to be a long labor intensive project? I guess this gives me an excuse to put a locker in as well.


Oh, and bonus project was found. I noticed a puddle under the rear drivers tire. Turns out there's a cracked brake line and it completely bled out.


The inner seals are a bit of a pain to replace since the carrier needs to come out. I made a press tool out of some random stuff in the garage instead of trying to swing a hammer inside the housing. The pinion seal isn't that bad to do, as the preload on the pinion is controlled via shims instead of a crush washer if I am correct. That just means you can R&R the yoke without fear of killing your pinion bearings. I consistently see damage on Dana 60s from contamination is the bearing surface on the outer axles. The seal between the outer stub axles and the spindle is pretty lousy. Water and mud gets in there, to the inner part of your spindle and the roller bearing there dies a horrible death. That bearing rides directly on the outer shaft, with no race. Outer axles are not cheap, it is a lot easier to pull the spindles all the way off when doing wheel bearings, inspect, replace or repack that bearing and replace the crummy seals. It is a superhighway for contamination to get to your wheel bearings.

Personally I don't run outer seals on my housing, but I also do not use my truck as a submarine. I just give it a spray out with a garden hose from time to time. Also, if you are actually driving your rig where it might get contaminated it isn't all that bad to pull it apart and repack everything. It really isn't that hard. The seals are there to keep most of the good stuff in and most of the bad stuff out. I still do routine gear oil changes because in the end regular old gear oil is cheap. A 5 gallon pail of clean dinosaur oil is going to do a lot better job of lubricating than a contaminated fill of uber expensive synthetic stuff like Royal Purple.
 

fasttruck

Well-known member
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175
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Location
Mesa, AZ
Don't forget a valuable accessory for any truck with a winch is a snatch block and an anchor chain. At least 1 of each. The Army OVM authorization for a vehicle with a winch includes 1ea snatch block, anchor chain, and if equipped with a shear pin, a hammer and punch to change out the shear pins. Obviously you would have a supply of the issue shear pins on board too.
 
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