Bobbing my Deuce

[Blythewoodjoe]

I have invented lots of tools over the years and one of the best is an adapter for my drill that allows me to mount it to almost anything. I pitched the working modle to Bosch a couple of years ago and they seems to like it but then never got back to me. I need to watch their stuff.

Regardless, the real key to drilling anything with a hand held drill is to limit the rotation and apply force to the drill. This can be done for frame drilling by putting something into the handle (if your drill has one) at the front of the drill that can extend over and rest against anything. That will limit rotation. You can then take a c-clamp or chain or what every you can think up, and attach it to the frame about 4" from the drill. Then take a stick or pipe and put under this object and over the back of the dirll and have about 24" hanging over the other side of the drill. Use one hand to hold the drill and the other to push against this extention. You can push a 1/2 bit threw a frame in about 15 second with very little effort. This isn't a theory, it's how I do stuff like that.

Hope that helped and didn't confuse. I am the master of confussion. Anybody want a diagram

 

[Elwenil]

On the welding bit, I would not weld on a truck frame. They are made different than light duty car and pickup frames. They are heat tempered and heating them will cause them to lose strength and fail. Same with drilling the flanges, it causes a stress point and will eventually fail. If you do weld the frame, I would not trust it for anything more than a show piece.

 

[55Cameo]

I cut and welded back together the rear frame on mine and have snatched the heck out of it pulling people out and getting pulled out (ask devilman) many times and it is still in one piece. I don't think that the frames on M35's are heat treated at all by the way that they cut with a sawzall and torch. Now, I wouldn't try welding on a new pickup frame like that. They are engineered stamped steel and heat treated.

 

[Streetgliderx]

i weld for a living and i have welded on things ranging from trucks to prostetic legs to helicopters to tractor trailer frames like mentioned above. i personally have never seen a quality weld on a frame break. that being said folks who do something for a living have quite different standards as to what quality is. i will trust anything i weld on. but i do it for 12hrs a day 6 days a week and i weld on natural gas pipelines for a living so i guess my point is i aint skeered to weld it i personally don't like bolts... i can never find my wrenches and i ALWAYS have my torch handy

 

[55Cameo]

Well, I would say that my welding is quality. At least the dozens of 200+mph dragsters, funnycars and prostocks that are running down 1/4 mile tracks and not falling apart should attest to that.

 

[Streetgliderx]

then i would say your frame should be trust worthy!

btw i drool over your truck! its my background on my pc

 

[Elwenil]

I do not doubt the welding abilities of some of the members here at SteelSoldiers, however the TM clearly state that the frames are not repairable and if found to be out of line, the truck is unserviceable:

If measured frame rails are out of tolerance, notify supervisor. If
frame rails are verified to be out of tolerance, truck will be classified
as unserviceable.

Also note that all the frame brackets and related hardware are all riveted or bolted in place. If it's in the manual, then that's good enough for me to steer away from welding on them. Also, the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration, which regulates just about any kind of commercial size truck states:

(d) Parts and accessories shall not be welded to the frame or chassis of a commercial motor vehicle except in accordance with the vehicle manufacturer's recommendations. Any welded repair of the frame must also be in accordance with the vehicle manufacturer’s recommendations.

Since the TMs are made in conjunction with with manufacturers, I think it can be reasonable to say that repairs are not recommended. Naturally the guidelines in the TMs are for vehicles that are to be combat ready at all times and could potentially see a lot more abuse than the average civilian owned MV, but I would think the age, weight and the fact that it's used on public roads would rate similar caution with critical systems. But it's not my truck and the chances of it being on a road near me are slim, so do whatever you wish. Just my .02

 

[Rebelpride]

Welding Frames

I work for a OEM truck body manufacturer and I have also seen stickers on the frame rails of tractor trailers warning not to weld on the frame. So after seeing the guys where I work cut, weld, and drill holes in frame rails I asked the supervisor of that dept. and he told me that you can cut and weld whatever you want behind the leaf springs AND you can weld on the frame rail flanges AS LONG as you weld lengthwise and NOT across as this will cause a failure.

 

[Djfreema]

RE: Welding Frames

I have decided to just bolt them on. I had a needed break from the truck and borrowed some reamers from Will Wagner and can hopefully get some work done tonight if mama says its ok, being "her day" and all.

 

[Streetgliderx]

RE: Welding Frames

i do not disput the fact that it is not recomended and truthfully would not want to see it done by just anyone. i think the guidelines and things are put into place to insure against the percentage of folks who will weld on the frames without the proper knowledge. but as i mentioned before i have never seen a quality weld break. i get calls all the time to weld on various items around here due to the fact that i own a purpose built welding rig that can be driven anywhere it is needed. i always get calls to fix things where someone welded it and it failed, and all of these times it is a less than desirable welding that failed. as in undercut, insuficient penetration, or just plain not tied in well to the existing steel.

but as said earlier just my .02 cents worth. not trying to cause hard feelins he has a very sound argument, me on the other hand never really followed any rules so i would weld it.

 

[Elwenil]

RE: Welding Frames

No hard feelings at all, I just think it's important on a public forum that can have many, many readers of wildly differing skill levels that we put out the whole story and the recommended course of action. I have welded things that I know shouldn't have been welded, but I knew the risks involved and I was the only one to pay the price if it failed. In a situation like this forum, where this post will be around for many years and could pop up in a Google search after we have moved on to other interests, that we should err on the side of caution for the benefit of future forum readers who may, or may not have the ability to weld a frame, or may or may not know the risks involved with taking the temper out of the frame. Again, I did not intend to create an argument, but simply to advocate that welding on the frame may not be the best course of action for the average backyard mechanic. I'm not trying to belittle Djfreema's abilities in any way, but the way the question was posted made me wonder if he was aware of all the ins and outs of frame issues. At any rate, I think we've covered all the bases on this aspect of the topic, lol.

 

[beaubeau]

RE: Welding Frames

Wow, what a piece of work! We have Licensed, Certified Welders that tell us it can't be done, We have people thet buy MV cheap, Clean and paint the same, sell for $10,000.00, or $12,000.00 in Perfect shape, guaranteed not to Crack,chip or peal, and we have politicians that don't lie!! Then we have people who believe and will do it or Buy it because someone said it is Great, Because someone said so!!Then there are those that do what has to be done!!Save money and sing all the way to the bank!! America the Great!!

 

[Streetgliderx]

Re: RE: Welding Frames

No hard feelings at all, At any rate, I think we've covered all the bases on this aspect of the topic, lol.

i think we can agree on that! excellent point

Wow, what a piece of work! We have Licensed, Certified Welders that tell us it can't be done, We have people thet buy MV cheap, Clean and paint the same, sell for $10,000.00, or $12,000.00 in Perfect shape, guaranteed not to Crack,chip or peal, and we have politicians that don't lie!! Then we have people who believe and will do it or Buy it because someone said it is Great, Because someone said so!!Then there are those that do what has to be done!!Save money and sing all the way to the bank!! America the Great!!

lost me. but there is no such thing as a certified welder in my feild. i have to test on every job i show up on, for that job and no test are transferable so my skills for one company are not worthy of another so i test again.... if failed its a long ride home with nothing to show but spent fuel... and i have been all over the USA welding.

 

[beaubeau]

RE: Re: RE: Welding Frames

Hey streetzglider, I believe anyone who is a good worker and good at what he does will always have a job! 30 years ago I was neither for or against the "Union workers", until I had to join. Then I found out that the Unions Protect the guys who Goof off, and takes incintive away from the guy who is a hard worker. The good thing about working for Unions, is the Retirement I am now getting!! Good Luck, Phil

 

[Blythewoodjoe]

RE: Re: RE: Welding Frames

If I may add one more thought to this thought provoking thread.

I have welded lots of truck frames and right or wrong, people do it every day. I trust no weld including my own. If the virgin metal can break any weld can. I was a pipe welder for many years and do believe a good weld will be as strong as the metal it's attached to. Having said the above contradictory words, if it can be bolted, I prefer that if for no other reason but the fact that you are possibly joining two metals of different tensile strengths. I don't know what spring hangers are made of but I would be surprised if it was the exact same molecular structure as the frame. The rear spring hangers on my M3A1 scout car are welded and that has worried me. Probably always will.

 

[Djfreema]

RE: Re: RE: Welding Frames

OK, Slow progress but it drives again! I have no brakes because the steel line line to the rear was real rusty and develpoed a pinhole leak before I decided to cut it. I started to cut the rest of the bed down tonight but it was too loud so it will have to wait till tomorrow. The driveshaft was only $125 to get lengthened, I expected to pay more. The pictures are a few days old and I have since hooked the airlines back up as well as remounted the lights. It spins the tires real easy now when I back up my driveway. Things I still have to do, replace the steel brake line, rebuild wheels cylinders, cut 36" from the bed and re weld it. Then I'll worry about singling it out and getting rid of the pizza cutters. I can see a light at the end of the tunnel!

 

[Offroadfabworks]

RE: Re: RE: Welding Frames

Looking good DJ.. Looks like them parts got put to good use

 

[Polverone]

Looking like real progress there Devin.
Glad to see that Coast is still doing good work at a fair price.
Can't wait to get my house finished so I can devote more time to my Deuce.

 

[Djfreema]

Thanks for taking care of me on the parts Offroadfabworks! Im down in San Diego right now with family and will hopefully be back early tomorrow to finish up the truck.

 

[Djfreema]

Took the day off work today and got a solid 6 hours of work done before my stupidity got me injured. Got the 2 front wheel cylinders rebuilt and the bed cut down and set back on the frame. I was under the back of the truck hooking up the lights and checking where I needed to trim the bed when I used the unsecured, off balance bed to help me up, well, the bed came crashing down on top of me. I'm pretty sure I have a broken pinkie toe and me knee got smashed in between the ground and bed as well as a nice cut on my head. I dont think I broke anything in my knee but I can no longer bend it. Luckily my 1/2" impact was on the ground and broke the fall keeping the bed from completely flattening my knee and foot. I was thinking today how I had gotten so much work done so safely on this project, I guess I jinxed myself. Anyway the bed is back on and secured with tie downs until I can get the fine trimming done and weld it back together. Just need one new rear brake hose and bleed the brakes.